ROUGH DRAFT 1 2 YOU HAVE REQUESTED WE PROVIDE AN INITIAL, UNEDITED 3 TRANSLATION OF A DEPOSITION. WE ARE PLEASED TO DO SO 4 WITH THE UNDERSTANDING THAT: 5 IT IS NOT A "TRANSCRIPT" OR THE "RECORD"; 6 IT IS TO BE VIEWED ONLY BY COUNSEL AND/OR THEIR LEGAL 7 ASSISTANTS; 8 IT WILL NOT BE REPRESENTED IN WHOLE OR IN PART AS AN 9 OFFICIAL TRANSCRIPT; 10 IT WILL NOT BE QUOTED FROM IN WHOLE OR IN PART; 11 ANY DISPARITY BETWEEN IT AND THE FINAL, OFFICIAL 12 TRANSCRIPT WILL NOT BE THE SUBJECT OF ANY CONTENTION, 13 ISSUE, MOTION, OR ANY LEGAL SANCTION; 14 THE CERTIFIED SHORTHAND REPORTER AND ANY AGENTS 15 THEREOF 16 ARE RELEASED FROM ANY LIABILITY THAT MAY ARISE FROM 17 THE PRODUCTION OF THE INITIAL TRANSLATION; 18 IT WILL BE DESTROYED WHEN THE CERTIFIED TRANSCRIPT IS 19 AVAILABLE. 20 THE QUALITY OF THE INITIAL TRANSLATION WILL IN PART 21 BE DEPENDENT ON THE PACE OF THE DIALOGUE, CORRECT 22 SPELLINGS OF PROPER NAMES FURNISHED IN ADVANCE, AND THE 23 GENERAL COOPERATION OF ALL THE PARTIES. 24 THE INITIAL TRANSLATION IS APT TO BE REPLETE WITH 25 MISTRANSLATIONS AND NONTRANSLATIONS BECAUSE OF THE 226 ROUGH DRAFT 1 LIMITED INTELLIGENCE OF THE COMPUTER, BUT ONE CAN EXPECT 2 IN EXCESS OF A 95% TRANSLATION RATE. NEVERTHELESS, ANY 3 RELIANCE ON THE ACCURACY OR COMPLETENESS OF THE INITIAL 4 TRANSLATION IS AT THE RISK OF THE USER. 5 SINCE THIS SERVICE WILL BE GENERATED BY A CERTIFIED 6 SHORTHAND REPORTER AS THE IMPARTIAL DEPOSITION OFFICER, 7 IT WILL BE AVAILABLE TO ALL PARTIES UNDER THE DOCTRINE 8 OF EQUAL ACCESS. IT IS THE DUTY OF THE ATTORNEY TAKING 9 THE DEPOSITION TO INFORM THE PARTIES OF THE INTENTION TO 10 USE THIS SERVICE. 11 I N D E X 12 DEPONENT: VICTORIA MUNOZ RICHART-POVALL 13 EXAMINATION 14 BY RONALD COZAD 15 16 INDEX OF EXHIBITS 17 FOR THE PLAINTIFF: 18 NO. DESCRIPTION PAGE 39 MINUTES DATED 9/22/2006 FROM MIRACOSTA 237 19 COMMUNITY COLLEGE (1 PAGE) 20 40 DECLARATION IN SUPPORT OF A VOTE OF NO 238 CONFIDENCE (9 PAGES) 21 41 LETTER TO CONCERNED FULL-TIME FACULTY 239 22 DATED 11/28/2006 (3 PAGES) 23 42 LETTER DATED 2/5/2007 TO CHARLES ADAMS 242 FROM TRUSTEES CARRANZA, SIMON AND 24 STRATTAN (BATES 1103) 25 43 E-MAIL DATED 2/23/2007 FROM VICTORIA 242 RICHART SUBJECT NOTES AND TRANSCRIBED 227 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 AUDIO SEGMENTS FROM 2/20/07 BOARD MEETING BATES 863-876 2 44 E-MAIL DATED 2/21/2007 FROM VICTORIA 244 3 RICHART SUBJECT INVESTIGATION OF LEAK TO THE PRESS BATES 852 4 45 SUMMARY OF INVESTIGATIVE FINDINGS 245 5 ARISING FROM COMPLAINTS OF ABUSE OF MIRACOSTA RESOURCES IN THE HORTICULTURE 6 DEPARTMENT 12/2005 - 4/2007 7 46 E-MAIL DATED 2/23/2007 FROM VICTORIA 250 RICHART SUBJECT ACADEMIC SENATE COUNCIL 8 MEETING TODAY BATES 877-878 9 47 LETTER DATED 3/19/2007 TO DAN SHINOFF 252 FROM ROBERT OTTILIE BATES 1034-1035 10 48 E-MAIL DATED 3/20/2007 FROM VICTORIA 258 11 RICHART SUBJECT INSURANCE ANALYSIS BATES 932-934 12 49 LETTER DATED 3/30/2007 TO DAN SHINOFF 268 13 FROM ROBERT OTTILIE BATES 1050-1051 14 50 FAX TO DANIEL SHINOFF FROM LORETTA 271 BURKE DATED 4/26/2007 BATES 1088-1092 15 51 SETTLEMENT COMMUNICATIONS SUBJECT TO 288 16 EVIDENCE CODE 1152 DATED 8/15/2007 17 52 DEFENDANT VICTORIA RICHART'S MEMORANDUM 333 OF POINTS AND AUTHORITIES IN SUPPORT OF 18 ANTI-SLAPP MOTION TO STRIKE THE COMPLAINT UNDER CCP 425.16 (10 PAGES) 19 53 WEB PAGE ENTITLED MIRACOSTA PRESIDENT'S 356 20 REMOVAL AIM OF 2 TRUSTEES (1 PAGE) 21 54 LETTER DATED 5/17/2007 TO DAN SHINOFF 359 FROM ROBERT OTTILIE (1 PAGE) 22 55 WEB PAGE ENTITLED DISMISSED MIRACOSTA 359 23 OFFICIAL FILES SUIT (1 PAGE) 24 56 WEB PAGE ENTITLED DRIVER OF STOLEN CAR 364 ARRESTED AFTER CHASE (1 PAGE) 25 57 WEB PAGE ENTITLED DISCUSSION OF CALL TO 365 228 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 FIRE NOT ON MIRACOSTA AGENDA (1 PAGE) 2 58 VICTORIA RICHART E-MAIL TO MCC FACULTY 366 AND STAFF 6-6-07 (3 PAGES) 3 59 COLLEGE TRUSTEES HOLD THE LINE ON 368 4 FACULTY SALARIES ARTICLE FROM NORTH COUNTY TIMES (2 PAGES) 5 60 WEB PAGE FROM NORTH COUNTY TIMES DATED 375 6 6/19/2007 BY PHILIP IRELAND (2 PAGES) 7 61 PAID POLITICAL ADVERTISEMENT "TO THE 376 CITIZENS, TAXPAYERS, AND CURRENT 8 TRUSTEES OF MIRACOSTA COLLEGE" (1 PAGE) 9 62 E-MAIL FROM JONATHAN COLE TO VICTORIA 377 RICHART SUBJECT JUNE 5 PRESS RELEASE (1 10 PAGE) 11 63 E-MAIL FROM VICTORIA RICHART TO 378 JONATHAN COLE SUBJECT PRESS RELEASE 12 DATED 6/13/2007 (2 PAGES) 13 64 LETTER DATED 6/6/2007 TO THE EMPLOYEES 379 OF MIRACOSTA COLLEGE FROM CHARLES ADAMS 14 (2 PAGES) 15 65 WEB PAGE ENTITLED LET'S GET THE DEVIL 380 EXPELLED FROM COLLEGE (2 PAGES) 16 66 LETTER DATED 5/31/2007 TO DAN SHINOFF 381 17 FROM ROBERT OTTILIE BATES 1067 18 67 LETTER DATED 6/14/2007 TO DAN SHINOFF 382 FROM ROBERT OTTILIE BATES 1068 19 68 NOTICE OF SPECIAL BOARD MEETING DATED 382 20 6/15/2007 (2 PAGES) 21 22 23 24 25 229 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 WITNESS INSTRUCTED NOT TO ANSWER PAGE LINE 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 REQUESTED INFORMATION 16 PAGE LINE 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 230 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT WITNESS INSTRUCTED NOT TO ANSWER PAGE LINE REQUESTED INFORMATION PAGE LINE 231 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT APPEARANCES: FOR THE PLAINTIFF: LAW OFFICES OF RONALD J. COZAD BY RONALD J. COZAD, ESQ. SUITE 214 2006 PALOMAR AIRPORT ROAD CARLSBAD, CALIFORNIA 92008 760.431.8200 FOR THE DEFENDANT: STUTZ ARTIANO SHINOFF & HOLTZ, APC BY JACK M. SLEETH, JR., ESQ. SUITE 200 2488 HISTORIC DECATUR ROAD SAN DIEGO, CALIFORNIA 92106 619.232.3122 FOR THE DEFENDANT: WINET, PATRICK & WEAVER BY RANDALL L. WINET, ESQ. SUITE 200 440 S. MELROSE DRIVE VISTA, CALIFORNIA 92081 760-758-6420 ALSO PRESENT: RENE DE LATHAUWER VIDEOGRAPHER, LEON JAMES PAGE DEPOSITION OF VICTORIA MUNOZ RICHART-POVALL, TAKEN BY THE PETITIONER AT 440 SOUTH MELROSE, SUITE 200 VISTA, CALIFORNIA, ON TUESDAY THE 3RD DAY OF MARCH, 2008, AT 1:12 P.M., BEFORE A CERTIFIED SHORTHAND REPORTER LINDA MARQUETTE, CSR NO. 11874. 232 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: THIS IS A CONTINUATION OF 2 THE DEPOSITION FOR VICTORIA MUNOZ RICHART. AND THE CASE 3 BETWEEN JAMES PAGE AND THE -- I'M SORRY. 4 MR. SLEETH: MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY COLLEGE. 5 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY COLLEGE 6 THANK YOU VERY MUCH CASE NO. 37-2007-00055219-CU-WM-NC 7 AND THE TIME IS 116 IS IT -- 113, I'M SORRY. 8 AND MR. WINET? 9 MR. WINET: YES. I WANTED TO MAKE A STATEMENT 10 FOR THE RECORD. FOLLOWING THE FIRST SESSION OF 11 DR. RICHART'S DEPOSITION, APPARENTLY THE FIRST 12 DEPOSITION TRANSCRIPT WAS TYPED OUT IN ROUGH AND WAS 13 SUBMITTED TO THE PRESS WITHOUT IT BEING REVIEWED OR 14 SIGNED BY THE WITNESS. AND WITHOUT ANY AUTHORITY OR 15 AGREEMENT ON BEHALF OF OUR OFFICE. WE BELIEVE THAT'S AN 16 IMPROPER ACT AND SHOULD NOT BE DONE AND I AM MAKING THAT 17 STATEMENT FOR THE RECORD. 18 MR. WINET: IS THERE SOME AUTHORITY FOR THAT 19 POSITION? 20 MR. COZAD: WELL, I THINK THERE SHOULD BE SOME 21 REVIEW OF THE RULES OF PROFESSIONAL CONDUCT FOR LAWYERS 22 IN DOING SO AND IF THERE'S ANY REPRESENTATION THAT WAS 23 MADE THAT THAT WAS THE DEPOSITION TRANSCRIPT PRIOR TO IT 24 BEING REVIEWED AND SIGNED AND BEING PROVIDED TO SOME 25 THIRD PARTY THEN THAT WOULD BE AN INCORRECT 233 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 REPRESENTATION AND AN IMPROPER REPRESENTATION. 2 MR. COZAD: OKAY. I'M NOT HEARING ENOUGH OF A 3 SPECIFIC REFERENCE TO A RULE OR A STATUTE. 4 MR. WINET: MR. COZAD, YOU WILL HANDLE THE 5 CASE THE WAY YOU DESIRE. I WILL HANDLE THE CASE THE WAY 6 I DESIRE. I'M JUST TELLING YOU THAT IT WAS IMPROPER TO 7 DO SO. 8 MR. COZAD: OKAY. I'M JUST TRYING TO WEED OUT 9 THE LECTURING FROM THE CITATIONS TO RULES THAT I SHOULD 10 BE AWARE OF. I CAN DEAL WITH THE LECTURING BUT IF YOU 11 HAVE A SPECIFIC RULE THAT YOU CONTEND APPLIES I WOULD BE 12 HAPPY TO SEE IT AND IF IT'S SOMETHING THAT GOVERNS OUR 13 CONDUCT I WOULD CERTAINLY OBSERVE IT. BUT -- 14 MR. WINET: I DON'T THINK -- I THINK THERE'S 15 RULES INVOLVING REPRESENTATIONS AS TO WHETHER SOMETHING 16 IS A PROPER TRANSCRIPT AND IF IT HAS NOT BEEN REVIEWED 17 AND SIGNED BY A WITNESS, TO PROVIDE IT TO SOMEONE AND TO 18 SAY IT IS A TRANSCRIPT OF THE DEPOSITION WOULD BE AN 19 INCORRECT REPRESENTATION. 20 MR. COZAD: I UNDERSTAND YOUR POINT. ALL 21 RIGHT. 22 BY MR. COZAD: 23 Q. ALL RIGHT. WHAT I'D LIKE TO DO THIS AFTERNOON 24 IS TALK, YOU KNOW WE HAVE BEEN GOING SOMEWHAT 25 CHRONOLOGICALLY THROUGH THE DOCUMENTS. AND I'D LIKE TO 234 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BACKTRACK A LITTLE BIT TO INCLUDE A DISCUSSION OF SOME 2 OF THE NEW MATERIALS THAT YOUR ATTORNEY PRODUCED FOR US 3 LAST TIME SO THAT YOU HAVE AN IDEA WHAT WE'RE GOING TO 4 DO TODAY, OKAY? 5 A. (NODS.) 6 Q. DO YOU UNDERSTAND YOU'RE STILL UNDER OATHS? 7 A. I AM UNDER OATH. 8 Q. OKAY. LET'S, IF WE CAN, DO YOU HAVE THE 9 EXHIBITS IN FRONT OF YOU? 10 A. I DO. 11 Q. LET'S LOOK AT EXHIBIT 22, PLEASE. 12 A. UH-HUH. 13 Q. NOW WAS THIS THE STATEMENT OF SUPPORT THAT YOU 14 MENTIONED WAS DISCUSSED AT A PREVIOUS CLOSED SESSION OF 15 THE BOARD? 16 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION IS VAGUE. 17 ANSWER IF YOU UNDERSTAND. 18 A. CAN YOU REPHRASE IT, PLEASE? 19 BY MR. COZAD: 20 Q. WELL, MY RECOLLECTION OF THE TESTIMONY ON 21 FRIDAY -- AND CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG -- WAS THAT THIS 22 STATEMENT OF SUPPORT WAS DISCUSSED AT SOME POINT DURING 23 A CLOSED SESSION PRIOR TO OCTOBER 3RD, 2006. 24 MR. WINET: WELL, NO NO NO. WE'RE -- FIRST OF 25 ALL WE'RE NOT GOING TO BE ASKING THE WITNESS WHAT WAS 235 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 SAID IN THE PRIOR DEPOSITION. AND SECONDLY, WE'RE NOT 2 GOING TO DISCUSS WHAT'S BEEN DISCUSSED IN CLOSED 3 SESSION. SO AS THE QUESTION IS CURRENTLY PHRASED, I'LL 4 INSTRUCT THE WITNESS NOT TO ANSWER. (MARK.) 5 BY MR. COZAD: 6 Q. WHEN WAS IT SUGGESTED THAT A STATEMENT OF 7 SUPPORT BE PREPARED FOR YOU PRIOR TO OCTOBER 3RD, 2006? 8 MR. SLEETH: OBJECTION, ASKED AND ANSWERED. 9 A. I BELIEVE THAT I ANSWERED IT ALREADY AT THE 10 LAST DEPOSITION, THAT IT WAS IN A CLOSED SESSION PRIOR 11 TO THE BOARD MEETING ON OCTOBER 3RD. 12 BY MR. COZAD: 13 Q. WHAT DATE WAS THE CLOSED SESSION? 14 A. I DON'T RECALL. 15 Q. WAS IT SEPTEMBER 22ND, 2006? 16 A. I DON'T RECALL. I'M SORRY. I'M SURE YOU HAVE 17 SOMETHING THAT TELLS YOU THIS WHEN IT WAS. I DON'T HAVE 18 BOARD MINUTES OR AGENDA ITEM IN FRONT OF ME TO ANSWER 19 YOUR QUESTION. 20 Q. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE'LL MARK AS EXHIBIT 39. 21 (EXHIBIT 39 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 22 BY MR. COZAD: 23 Q. DOES EXHIBIT 39 APPEAR TO BE A TRUE AND 24 CORRECT COPY OF MINUTES OF A SPECIAL BOARD MEETING HELD 25 FRIDAY, SEPTEMBER 22, 2006? 236 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. I DON'T THINK SO. IT IS NOT SIGNED. I DON'T 2 KNOW WHAT THIS REPRESENTS. SOMETHING THAT HAPPENED ON 3 SEPTEMBER 22ND, 2006, THAT IS A TRUE AND CORRECT 4 DOCUMENT TO BE SIGNED BY THE BOARD PRESIDENT AND MYSELF 5 AS A COLLEGE PRESIDENT. THIS DOCUMENT IS NOT SIGNED. 6 Q. OKAY. WAS -- STRIKE THAT. 7 NEXT, 40. I'LL -- LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE'VE 8 MARKED AS EXHIBIT 40. 9 (EXHIBIT 40 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 10 BY MR. COZAD: 11 Q. HAVE YOU SEEN EXHIBIT 40 PRIOR TO TODAY? 12 A. I WOULD THINK SO, YES. IT LOOKS LIKE THE 13 DECLARATION OF THE VOTE OF NO CONFIDENCE THAT WAS ISSUED 14 BY THE FULL TIME FACULTY. 15 Q. ALL RIGHT. IF YOU WOULD LOOK TO THE LAST 16 PAGE, PLEASE. 17 A. UH-HUH. 18 Q. IS IT YOUR RECOLLECTION THAT THESE ARE THE 19 PEOPLE THAT SIGNED OR APPROVED OF THE DECLARATION IN 20 SUPPORT OF NO CONFIDENCE? 21 A. I CANNOT RECALL THE ORIGINAL DOCUMENT THAT I 22 RECEIVED IN COMPARISON TO THIS DOCUMENT. 23 Q. ARE THERE ANY NAMES ON THE LIST THAT YOU 24 BELIEVE SHOULD NOT BE ON THE LIST? 25 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, CALLS FOR SPECULATION, 237 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 CALLS FOR IMPROPER OPINION AND CONCLUSION AS TO WHO 2 SHOULD AND SHOULD NOT BE ON THE LIST. YOU CAN ANSWER TO 3 THE EXTENT YOU CAN. 4 A. I DON'T KNOW HOW TO ANSWER THAT. NO, I CANNOT 5 GIVE YOU AN OPINION OR AN ASSESSMENT. 6 BY MR. COZAD: 7 Q. OKAY. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE'LL MARK AS 8 EXHIBIT 41. 9 (EXHIBIT 41 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 10 BY MR. COZAD: 11 Q. DID YOU PREPARE EXHIBIT 41? 12 A. I DON'T KNOW. 13 Q. THIS APPEARS TO BE A LETTER DATED NOVEMBER 28, 14 2006 ADDRESSED TO CONCERNED FULL TIME FACULTY. APPEARS 15 TO HAVE A SIGNATURE LINE WITH YOUR NAME. WOULD YOU LOOK 16 AT IT AND SEE IF IT'S SOMETHING THAT YOU PREPARED? 17 A. IT, IT LOOKS LIKE SOMETHING THAT I PREPARED. 18 I DON'T REMEMBER WHY IT DOESN'T HAVE LETTERHEAD OR MY 19 ACTUAL SIGNATURE INSTEAD OF A WHAT APPEARS TO BE A 20 COMPUTER SIGNATURE. IT COULD BE THAT THIS WAS TAKEN OFF 21 OF AN E-MAIL ATTACHMENT WHICH WOULD NOT HAVE THE 22 LETTERHEAD OR MY ACTUAL SIGNATURE. BUT IT LOOKS LIKE 23 SOMETHING THAT I -- A LETTER THAT I DID WRITE. I CANNOT 24 TELL YOU IF IT'S EXACTLY THE LETTER THAT I WROTE BUT IT 25 LOOKS LIKE IT. 238 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. WOULD YOU LOOK AT THE SECOND TO THE LAST 2 PARAGRAPH. 3 A. SECOND TO THE LAST? UH-HUH. 4 Q. LET ME READ THE LANGUAGE TO YOU. IT SAYS, 5 QUOTE, **IF THE ALLEGATIONS AGAINST ME YIELD A VOTE OF 6 NO CONFIDENCE, IT WILL BE INTERPRETED NOT AS A VOTE 7 AGAINST THE LEADERSHIP I'VE EXHIBITED BUT AS A 8 PURPOSEFUL CAMPAIGN TO DESTROY MY REPUTATION BASED ON 9 RUMOR, GOSSIP, HEARSAY, MISINTERPRETATION OF THE FACTS, 10 AND A COMPLETE DISREGARD FOR THE LAWS THAT GOVERN THE 11 ACTIONS OF COLLEGE OFFICIALS. FURTHERMORE, IT WILL BE 12 SEEN AS AN ATTEMPT TO INTIMIDATE THE COLLEGE PRESIDENT 13 AND THE BOARD OF TRUSTEES INTO NOT CARRYING OUT OUR 14 DUTIES. CLOSE QUOTE. 15 DID YOU WRITE THOSE WORDS? 16 A. YES. 17 Q. DID YOU HAVE ANY ASSISTANCE WITH THE 18 PREPARATION OF THIS LETTER? 19 A. NO. 20 Q. DID YOU INTEND TO USE THIS AS A THREAT AGAINST 21 THE MIRACOSTA COLLEGE FULL TIME FACULTY THAT IF THEY 22 PRESENTS A VOTE OF NO CONFIDENCE THAT YOU WOULD FILE A 23 LAWSUIT AGAINST THE COLLEGE? 24 A. I DON'T THINK THAT'S WHAT MY WORDS SAY, 25 MR. COZAD. 239 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. I'M ASKING YOU IF THAT'S WHAT YOU INTENDED? 2 A. I DID NOT INTEND THAT. I DID NOT WRITE THAT. 3 Q. WHAT WAS IT THAT YOU DID NOT WRITE? 4 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION IS 5 ARGUMENTATIVE. SHE WAS RESPOND TO GO YOUR LAST 6 QUESTION. THE QUESTION IS ARGUMENTATIVE YOU ASKED A 7 SPECIFIC QUESTION AND SHE SAID I DID NOT WRITE THAT. 8 BY MR. COZAD: 9 Q. WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A PARAGRAPH HERE A FEW 10 MINUTES AGO -- 11 MR. WINET: NO, NO, YOUR QUESTION WAS -- 12 BY MR. COZAD: 13 Q. LET ME FINISH. LET ME FINISH, PLEASE. WE'RE 14 TALKING ABOUT A PARAGRAPH. A FEW MINUTES AGO I ASKED 15 HER IF SHE WROTE IT. IS YOUR ANSWER STILL THE SAME THAT 16 YES, YOU WROTE THAT PARAGRAPH? 17 A. YES, I WROTE THE PARAGRAPH. 18 Q. OKAY. WHAT YOU DIDN'T WRITE WAS THIS IS A 19 THREAT. AM I UNDERSTANDING YOUR TESTIMONY, CORRECTLY? 20 A. I DO NOT THINK SO, NO. YOU ASKED ME IF I HAD 21 INTENDED TO THREATEN THE FACULTY TO FILE A LAWSUIT AND I 22 SAID NO, I DID NOT BECAUSE I DID NOT WRITE THAT. 23 THERE'S NOTHING IN THIS PARAGRAPH THAT SAYS I WILL 24 THREATEN THE FACULTY WITH LEGAL ACTION. 25 Q. OKAY. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE'LL MARK AS 240 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 EXHIBIT 42. 2 (EXHIBIT 42 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. ON OR ABOUT FEBRUARY 5, 2007, DID TRUST WILL 5 TRUSTEE CARRANZA SIMON AND STRIKE THAT STRIKE THAT TON 6 ISSUE A LETTER TO PRESIDENT BOARD ADAMS RESPONDING TO 7 HIS LETTER THE PRIOR FRIDAY EVENING? 8 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, MAY CALLS FOR 9 SPECULATION, MAY LACK FOUNDATION AS TO THIS WITNESS. 10 YOU CAN ANSWER IF YOU KNOW. 11 A. I DON'T KNOW WHEN THEY ISSUED IT. I HAVE SEEN 12 THIS LETTER BEFORE. 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. OKAY. AND DO YOU RECALL SEEING IT ON OR ABOUT 15 FEBRUARY 5, 2007? 16 A. I DON'T RECALL THE SPECIFIC DATE I'M SORRY. 17 BY MR. COZAD: 18 Q. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE WILL MARK AS EXHIBIT 19 43. 20 (EXHIBIT 43 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 21 BY MR. COZAD: 22 Q. IT APPEARS TO BE AN E-MAIL FROM YOU AT FRIDAY, 23 FEBRUARY 23, 2007 REGARDING NOTES AND TRANSCRIBED AUDIO 24 SEGMENTS FROM FEBRUARY 20TH, '07 BOARD MEETING. DID YOU 25 PREPARE THE E-MAIL ON THE TOP PAGE? 241 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. I FORWARDED -- THE E-MAIL ON THE TOP PAGE THAT 2 I CLAIM OWNERSHIP OF IS THAT I FORWARDED TO THE BOARD OF 3 TRUSTEES AND I GUESS A COPY IS USUALLY SENT TO MY 4 EXECUTIVE ASSISTANTS OF WHAT I USUALLY SENT TO THE 5 TRUSTEES. FORWARDING TO THEM THE NOTES AND TRANSCRIBED 6 AUDIO SEGMENTS FROM THE BOARD MEETING OF THE 20TH THAT 7 HAD BEEN ISSUED BY THE PRESIDENT OF THE ACADEMIC SENATE 8 MR. COLE. I HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH ANY OF ITS 9 ATTACHMENTS OR ITS CONTENTS OTHER THAN FORWARDING WHAT 10 MR. COLE HAD FORWARDED. 11 Q. WHO IS GAIL SHIRLEY? 12 A. SHE IS A CLASSIFIED EMPLOYEE. SHE'S THE 13 SECRETARY TO THE VICE PRESIDENT OF BUSINESS SERVICES. 14 Q. OKAY. AND THE ATTACHED PAGES DO THEY APPEAR 15 TO BE THE NOTES PREPARED BY MS. SHIRLEY THAT RELATE? 16 A. I DON'T KNOW. 17 Q. RELATE? 18 A. I'VE NEVER READ THEM. THESE ARE UNOFFICIAL 19 NOTES SO ... 20 Q. THEY ARE UNOFFICIAL? 21 A. THEY ARE UNOFFICIAL NOTES I WOULD NOT READ 22 THROUGH SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 23 Q. OKAY. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE'VE MARKED AS 24 EXHIBIT 44. 25 (EXHIBIT 44 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 242 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. UH-HUH. 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. IT APPEARS TO BE TWO E-MAILS. TOP ONE APPEARS 4 TO BE FROM YOU SENT WEDNESDAY FEBRUARY 21, 2007 AT 5 5:37 P.M. DID YOU, DID YOU AUTHOR THE TOP E-MAIL? 6 A. IT LOOKS LIKE IT, YES. UH-HUH. 7 Q. OKAY. AND THIS IS FORWARDING AN E-MAIL THAT 8 YOU PREPARED AT 5:31 P.M.? 9 A. YES. IT WAS FORWARDING AN E-MAIL THAT I SENT 10 TO THE COLLEGE EMPLOYEES, THE ADMINISTRATORS THE 11 ACADEMIC SENATE AND THE CLASSIFIED EMPLOYEES REGARDING 12 THE INVESTIGATION OF THE LEAK TO THE PRESS ON THE 13 INVESTIGATION REPORT BY MR. PRICE. 14 Q. DID -- HOW MANY REPORTS DID MR. PRICE PREPARE 15 BY REPORTS I MEAN FINAL REPORTS OF HIS INVESTIGATION? 16 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION MAY BE 17 AMBIGUOUS THE WAY IT'S PHRASED. MAY CALL FOR 18 SPECULATION THE WAY IT'S PHRASED, BUT GO AHEAD. 19 MR. SLEETH: IT'S AT LEAST OVERBROAD IN THAT 20 SHE PROBABLY DOESN'T KNOW HOW MANY HE PREPARED. SHE 21 MIGHT KNOW HOW MANY WERE DELIVERED TO THE COLLEGE. 22 A. HE PREPARED ONLY ONE FINAL REPORT THAT WAS 23 PRESENTED IN THE PUBLIC MEETING OF THE BOARD OF TRUSTEES 24 ON APRIL 24TH, 2007. PRIOR TO THAT DATE HE PREPARED 25 SEVERAL REPORTS THAT WERE PRESENTED TO THE BOARD OF 243 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 TRUSTEES, NOT NECESSARILY A FINAL REPORT, BUT REPORTS AS 2 THINGS EVOLVED PURSUANT TO WHAT HE WAS ASKED TO DO. 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. DID YOU ASK HIM TO MAKE ANY CHANGES OR 5 MODIFICATIONS TO THE INTERIM REPORTS THAT YOU JUST 6 DESCRIBED? 7 A. NO. 8 Q. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE'LL MARK AS EXHIBIT 45. 9 IT APPEARS TO BE A DOCUMENT DATED APRIL 19, 2007 10 ENTITLED SUMMARY OF INVESTIGATIVE FINDINGS. 11 (EXHIBIT 45 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 12 BY MR. COZAD: 13 Q. WOULD YOU TAKE A LOOK AT THAT PLEASE? WOULD 14 YOU IDENTIFY FOR US EXHIBIT 45, IF YOU CAN. 15 A. WELL IT SAYS APRIL 19, SUMMARY OF 16 INVESTIGATIVE FINDINGS ARISING FROM COMPLAINTS OF ABUSE 17 OF MARRY SOURCINGS IN THE HORTICULTURE OF APRIL 52007. 18 MR. WINET: COUNSEL, I TAKE IT WE ARE NOT 19 BEING PROVIDED ONE OF THESE BECAUSE IT IS VOLUMINOUS, IS 20 THAT WHY? 21 MR. COZAD: I HADN'T ACTUALLY PLANNED TO REFER 22 TO IT TODAY. 23 MR. WINET: OKAY. NO PROBLEM. 24 MR. COZAD: BUT I WOULD BE HAPPY TO LET YOU 25 COPY IT IF YOU WOULD LIKE. 244 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MR. WINET: NO PROBLEM. 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. IF YOU WOULD TAKE A FEW MOMENTS AND TELL ME IF 4 THIS IS THE FINAL REPORT AS YOU UNDERSTAND IT? 5 A. OH MY GOSH. YOU KNOW, I WOULD NOT REMEMBER 6 THAT. I WOULD HAVE TO COMPARE IT TO THE REPORT THAT I 7 RECEIVED FOR ME TO MAKE THAT ASSESSMENT. FROM THE DATE 8 OF IT IT LOOKS LIKE IT IS BUT I DON'T KNOW WHERE YOU GOT 9 THIS COPY OR WHAT IT MEANS SO -- I WISH I COULD TELL BUT 10 IT LOOKS LIKE IT BUT I WOULDN'T KNOW. THE ONLY WAY TO 11 COMPARE IT IS TO SEE WHAT'S ON THE RECORD OF THE 12 APRIL 24TH BOARD MEETING THAT WAS PRESENTED TO THE 13 COLLEGE AND MAKE A COMPARISON PAGE BY PAGE. 14 Q. OKAY. DO YOU KNOW WHO LEAKED THE REPORT TO 15 THE NORTH COUNTY TIMES? 16 A. NO. 17 Q. DID YOU PERSONALLY CONDUCT ANY TYPE OF 18 INVESTIGATION OF WHO MAY HAVE LEAKED THE REPORT TO THE 19 NORTH COUNTY TIMES? 20 A. NO. 21 MR. WINET: LET ME MAKE A BELATED OBJECTION 22 THAT THE LAST QUESTION BECAUSE INVESTIGATION IS A BROAD 23 TERM AND MY OBJECTION IS THAT THE PRIOR E-MAIL THAT WE 24 MARKED COULD HAVE CONSIDERED AT LEAST A REFERENCE TO AN 25 INVESTIGATION SO I THINK THE QUESTION IS OVERBROAD FROM 245 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 THAT STANDPOINT BUT I THINK THE ANSWER ADEQUATELY ANSWER 2 THE QUESTION WITH THAT STATEMENT. 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. DID YOU ATTEMPT TO DETERMINE WHO LEAKED THE 5 REPORT TO THE NORTH COUNTY TIMES? 6 A. NO. 7 Q. DID YOU ASK ANYBODY ELSE TO ATTEMPT TO 8 DETERMINE WHO LEAKED THE REPORT TO THE NORTH COUNTY 9 TIMES? 10 A. I FORWARDED A REQUEST TO THE DISTRICT 11 ATTORNEY'S OFFICE ON BEHALF OF THE COLLEGE TO 12 INVESTIGATE THE LEAK OF THE REPORT. 13 Q. FOLLOWING YOUR REQUEST TO THE DISTRICT 14 ATTORNEY'S OFFICE DID YOU HAVE ANY FOLLOW-UP 15 COMMUNICATIONS WITH THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY TO DETERMINE 16 WHETHER THEY HAD DETERMINED WHO -- OKAY. ALL RIGHT. 17 I'M GOING TO CHEAT YOU OUT OF AN OBJECTION. SO I'M 18 GOING TO REPHRASE IT. 19 DID YOU ASK THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY WHAT HE 20 FOUND OUT? 21 MR. SLEETH: I LIKE THAT ONE. 22 BY MR. COZAD: 23 Q. YOU LIKE THAT ONE? 24 A. NO, I DID NOT. 25 Q. ALL RIGHT. DID YOU LEAK IT TO THE NORTH 246 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 COUNTY TIMES? 2 A. NO, I DID NOT. 3 Q. DID YOU ASK SOMEBODY ELSE TO LEAK IT TO THE 4 NORTH COUNTY TIMES? 5 A. NO, I DID NOT. 6 Q. DO YOU BELIEVE THAT GIVING THE REPORT TO THE 7 NORTH COUNTY TIMES IS A CRIMINAL ACT? 8 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, CALLS FOR AN IMPROPER 9 LEGAL OPINION AND CONCLUSION, LACKS FOUNDATION AS TO 10 THIS WITNESS. I THINK IT'S AN IMPROPER QUESTION TO ASK 11 IN DEPOSITION AND I'LL INSTRUCT THE WITNESS NOT TO 12 ANSWER.(MARK). 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. HAVE YOU EVER PUBLICLY STATED THAT LEAKING THE 15 INVESTIGATION REPORT TO THE NORTH COUNTY TIMES WAS A 16 CRIMINAL ACT? 17 A. I DON'T RECALL SAYING EXACTLY THAT IT'S A 18 CRIMINAL ACT BUT I DO RECALL BEING APPALLED BY THE LEAK 19 AND BEING VERY UPSET WITH THE FACT THAT IT HAD BEEN 20 LEAKED TO THE NORTH COUNTY TIMES BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T 21 HAVE THE PROPER PRECAUTIONS TO AVOID VIOLATING THE 22 PRIVACY RIGHTS OF A LOT OF THE EMPLOYEES THAT WERE 23 MENTIONED IN THE REPORT FOR WHICH I HAVE BEEN TAKING ON 24 AN UNDUE AMOUNT OF CRITICISMS FOR MONTHS BECAUSE I WAS 25 NOT RELEASING THAT KIND OF INFORMATION. SO I FOUND IT 247 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 TO BE AN INCREDIBLY APPALLING ACT WHOMEVER LEAKED IT 2 BECAUSE IT AFFECTED THE LIKELIHOOD AND THE PRIVACY OF A 3 LOT OF INDIVIDUALS. 4 Q. DID ANY OF THE PEOPLE MENTIONED IN THE REPORT 5 COMPLAIN TO YOU THAT THEIR RIGHT TO PRIVACY WAS 6 VIOLATED? 7 A. TO ME DIRECTLY? I DON'T RECALL THAT, NO. I 8 DON'T RECALL. 9 Q. DID ANY OF THE PEOPLE MENTION IN THE REPORT 10 COMPLAIN TO OTHERS TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE THAT THEIR RIGHTS 11 TO PRIVACY WERE VIOLATED BY GIVING THE REPORT TO THE 12 NORTH COUNTY TIMES? 13 A. I RECALL ATTORNEY-CLIENT CORRESPONDENCE TO 14 THAT AFFECT. 15 Q. FROM WHO? 16 A. FROM ATTORNEYS REPRESENTING THE EMPLOYEES AND 17 FROM ATTORNEYS REPRESENTING THE COLLEGE. 18 Q. WHICH EMPLOYEES? 19 A. THE EMPLOYEES THAT WERE MENTIONED IN THE 20 REPORT -- SOME OF THEM, NOT ALL OF THEM. 21 Q. WHICH EMPLOYEES BY NAME COMPLAINED THAT THEIR 22 PRIVACY RIGHTS WERE VIOLATED BY LEAKING THE REPORT TO 23 THE NORTH COUNTY TIMES? 24 MR. WINET: DID YOU SAY YOU OBTAINED THIS 25 INFORMATION FROM THE ATTORNEYS FOR THE COLLEGE? 248 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 THE WITNESS: WHAT I SAID WAS THAT I SAW 2 CORRESPONDENCE BETWEEN LEGAL COUNSEL FOR EMPLOYEES AND 3 LEGAL COUNSEL FOR THE COLLEGE. 4 MR. WINET: OKAY. THAT'S AN APPROPRIATE 5 QUESTION THEN. 6 A. AND CAN YOU REPEAT YOUR QUESTION PLEASE? 7 MR. COZAD: YES WE'LL ASK THE REPORTER TO READ 8 IT. 9 QUESTION: 10 A. I DID NOT SAY THAT THE EMPLOYEES COMPLAINED SO 11 I CANNOT GIVE YOU THE NAME OF THE EMPLOYEES WHO 12 COMPLAINED BECAUSE I DID NOT SAY THAT THE EMPLOYEES 13 COMPLAINED. 14 BY MR. COZAD: 15 Q. WHO WERE THE CLIENTS OF THE ATTORNEYS WHO 16 COMPLAINED ABOUT THE LEAKING OF THE NORTH COUNTY 17 TIMES -- THE REPORT TO THE NORTH COUNTY TIMES? 18 A. I BELIEVE IT WAS MS. TEXEIRA'S ATTORNEYS AND 19 MS. HATOFF'S ATTORNEYS. 20 MR. COZAD: LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE'LL MARK AS 21 EXHIBIT 46. 22 (EXHIBIT 46 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 23 MR. WINET: DO YOU HAVE ONE MORE OF THOSE? 24 AH, THERE WE GO. 25 249 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. IT APPEARS TO BE AN E-MAIL FROM YOU ON FRIDAY 3 FEBRUARY 23RD AT 3:29 P.M.? 4 A. YES IT LOOKS LIKE IT YES. 5 BY MR. COZAD: 6 Q. WHAT WAS YOUR PURPOSE IN SENDING THIS E-MAIL? 7 A. JUST WHAT THE E-MAIL SAYS IS THAT I -- I'LL 8 READ FROM IT. DEAR BOARD MEMBERS THIS MORNING THE 9 ACADEMIC SENATE COUNSEL HELD ITS REGULARLY SCHEDULED 10 MEETING NORMALLY I DON'T SUMMARIZE FOR YOU THE ACTIONS 11 OF THE ACADEMIC SENATE COUNSEL. INSTEAD WE MAKE THE 12 OFFICIAL MINUTES AVAILABLE TO YOU WHEN PUBLISHED. 13 HOWEVER, TRUSTEE STRATTAN WAS PRESENT AT THE MEETING 14 THEREFORE IN ORDER TO KEEP ALL BOARD MEMBERS EQUALLY 15 INFORMED I WILL BRIEFLY SUMMARIZE THE DISCUSSION THAT 16 DIRECTLY RELATES TO THE BOARD OF TRUSTEES. AND THEN I, 17 I SAY THAT NOTE SINCE TRUSTEE STRATTAN WAS PRESENT FAN 18 SHE WISHES TO ADD TO THIS SUMMARY IT CAN BE DONE IN A 19 SEPARATE E-MAIL AS INFORMATION ONLY TO YOU. AND THEN I 20 SUMMARIZE THE MEETING. 21 Q. OKAY. NOW IN THE SUBJECT LINE AT THE TOP IT 22 SAYS IN ALL CAPS "THIS MESSAGE IS FOR INFORMATION 23 PURPOSES -- I'M SORRY THIS MESSAGE IS FOR INFORMATION 24 ONLY. PLEASE DO NOT RESPONDS OR FORWARD THIS MESSAGE IN 25 ORDER TO AVOID A VIOLATION OF THE BROWN ACT." 250 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 WHAT WAS YOUR REFERENCE TO THE BROWN ACT? WHY 2 DID YOU, WHY DID YOU SAY THAT? 3 A. IT'S NOT IN THE SUBJECT MATTER. IT APPEARS ON 4 THIS PIECE OF PAPER AS PART OF THE SUBJECT MATTER. IT 5 WAS ACTUALLY PART OF THE MESSAGE ITSELF. IT'S NOT IN 6 THE SUBJECT AT ALL. THE SUBJECT WAS JUST ACADEMIC 7 SENATE COUNCIL MEETING. THIS PARTICULAR NOTICE, I 8 USUALLY REMIND THE BOARD OF TRUSTEES NOT TO ENGAGE IN 9 DIALOGUE IN WHICH THEY PUT THEIR OPINIONS OR SOUGHT TO 10 PUT THEIR POINT OF VIEW ON E-MAILS SO THAT THEY WOULD 11 NOT VIOLATE THE BROWN ACT. SO THIS IS JUST TO LET THEM 12 KNOW THAT THIS IS FOR INFORMATION ONLY AND THEY SHOULD 13 NOT BE RESPONDING TO ONE ANOTHER WITH THEIR OPINIONS OR 14 SUGGESTIONS ON HOW TO ACT ON THE INFORMATION. 15 Q. OKAY. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE'LL MARK AS 16 EXHIBIT 47. 17 (EXHIBIT 47 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 18 Q. | DID YOU RETAIN MR. OTTILIE PRIOR TO 19 MARCH 19, 2007? 20 A. I DID. 21 Q. HOW DID YOU COME TO KNOW MR. OTTILIE? 22 MR. WINET: OBJECTION MAY INVADE THE 23 ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE BUT GO AHEAD. I DON'T THINK 24 IT DOES AT THIS POINT WITH THE TYPE OF QUESTION BEING 25 ASKED. 251 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. I MET HIM BY MAKING AN APPOINTMENT WITH HIM. 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. DID SOMEBODY REFER YOU TO MR. OTTILIE? 4 A. I HEARD HIS NAME WAS REFERRED TO ME BY SEVERAL 5 PEOPLE, YES. 6 Q. DID ANY COUNSEL FOR THE COLLEGE DISTRICT REFER 7 YOU TO MR. OTTILIE? 8 A. I ASKED FOR NAMES OF ATTORNEYS FROM A LOT OF 9 PEOPLE, INCLUDING COUNSEL FOR THE COLLEGE AND THEY GAVE 10 ME SEVERAL NAMES. 11 Q. DID MR. SHIN OFF REFER YOU TO MR. OTTILIE? 12 A. I BELIEVE I JUST ANSWERED THAT QUESTION. 13 MR. WINET: I THINK HE'S ASKING YOU OTHER THAN 14 PROVIDING YOU MULTIPLE NAMES DID HE ACTUALLY REFER YOU 15 DIRECTLY TO MR. OTTILIE. BUT I MIGHT BE WRONG. IF IT'S 16 NOT THAT THEN IT IS THE SAME QUESTION. 17 A. CAN YOU EXPLAIN WHAT YOU MEAN BY REFER? 18 BECAUSE TO ME GIVING ME NAMES IS THAT. 19 BY MR. COZAD: 20 Q. DID MR. SHINOFF SUGGEST THAT YOU TALK TO MR. 21 OTTILIE ABOUT YOUR POTENTIAL CLAIM AGAINST THE COLLEGE? 22 A. MR. SHINOFF MENTIONED MR. OTTILIE AMONGST 23 OTHER ATTORNEYS WHEN I SOUGHT FOR NAMES. SINCE I'M NEW 24 TO THE SAN DIEGO AREA I ASKED SEVERAL PEOPLE WHO ARE IN 25 THE LEGAL PROFESSION FOR RECOMMENDATIONS. 252 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. WHAT DID YOU TELL MR. SHINOFF THAT YOU WERE 2 SEEKING LEGAL SERVICES FOR? 3 A. TO PROTECT MY RIGHTS. 4 Q. IN WHAT REGARD? 5 A. MY DUE PROCESS AND PRIVACY RIGHTS. 6 Q. IN A CLAIM AGAINST THE COLLEGE DISTRICT? 7 A. THOSE ARE NOT MY WORDS. 8 Q. NO, I'M ASKING? 9 A. I DID NOT SAY THAT. DON'T. 10 Q. I'M ASKING. DID YOU TELL MR. SHINOFF THAT YOU 11 WERE SEEKING LEGAL REPRESENTATION FOR A POTENTIAL CLAIM 12 AGAINST THE MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY COLLEGE DISTRICT? 13 A. I DID NOT. 14 Q. WHAT DID YOU TELL MR. SHINOFF THAT YOU WERE 15 LOOKING FOR IN A LAWYER? 16 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, MAY LACK FOUNDATION, 17 MAY ASSUME FACTS NOT IN EVIDENCE BUT GO AHEAD. 18 A. I JUST SAID I WANTED A LOCAL ATTORNEY. 19 BY MR. COZAD: 20 Q. WAS ANYONE ELSE PRESENT WHEN YOU HAD YOUR 21 CONVERSATION WITH MR. SHINOFF CONCERNING LEGAL 22 REPRESENTATION? 23 A. YES, THE PRESIDENT, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE 24 BOARD, MR. FERNANDEZ. THE CURRENT PRESIDENT AT THE TIME 25 OF THE BOARD, MR. ADAMS. 253 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. WHERE DID THIS CONVERSATION TAKE PLACE? 2 A. IN MY OFFICE AT THE COLLEGE. 3 Q. ON WHAT DATE? 4 A. I DON'T RECALL. 5 Q. WAS IT DURING THE SAME MEETING THAT YOU HAD 6 WITH MR. ADAMS AND MR. SHINOFF IN WHICH THEY HELPED YOU 7 WRITE SOME LETTERS? 8 MR. WINET: ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THE 9 FEBRUARY 2ND LETTER? 10 MR. COZAD: YEAH. THANK YOU. 11 A. NO, I DON'T THINK SO. 12 BY MR. COZAD: 13 Q. WAS IT BEFORE THE FEBRUARY 2ND LETTER WAS 14 PREPARED OR AFTER, THAT YOU HAD THIS MEETING WITH MR. 15 ADAMS AND MR. FERNANDEZ AND MR. SHINOFF IN WHICH YOU 16 DISCUSSED LEGAL REPRESENTATION? 17 A. AFTER. 18 Q. WHAT WAS THE PURPOSE OF THE MEETING? 19 A. WE WERE HAVING A LOT OF MEETINGS AT THE TIME, 20 MR. COZAD SO I'LL DO MY BEST TO TRY TO REMEMBER. BUT 21 THE MAJORITY OF THE MEETINGS WERE DESIGNED. ALSO 22 MR. LARSON WAS, DAVID LARSON WHO IS ANOTHER MEMBER THAT, 23 ANOTHER ATTORNEY WHO WORKS FOR THE COLLEGE. WE WERE IN 24 THE PROCESS OF ATTEMPTING TO PREPARE A PUBLIC 25 PRESENTATION ON THE OUTCOME OF THE INVESTIGATION WHILE 254 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 AT THE SAME TIME CONTINUING TO PROTECT THE PRIVACY 2 RIGHTS OF THE EMPLOYEES. SO WE WERE HAVING A LOT OF 3 STRATEGIC MEETINGS ON HOW TO GO ABOUT IT. AND MR. 4 FERNANDEZ BEING THE PRESIDENT OF THE BOARD WHEN THE 5 COMPLAINT FIRST WAS BROUGHT TO OUR ATTENTION AND MR. 6 ADAMS THE CURRENT BOARD PRESIDENT WERE THERE TO GUIDE 7 OUR DECISIONS, AND INSURE THAT WE WERE REPRESENTING THE 8 BOARD AS A WHOLE. SO I CAN'T TELL YOU WHAT DAY OR WHEN 9 IT WAS. I DON'T REMEMBER. 10 Q. DO YOU BELIEVE THAT GLORIA CARRANZA PLAYED ANY 11 ROLE IN THE LEAKING OF THE INVESTIGATION REPORT TO THE 12 NORTH COUNTY TIMES? 13 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, CALLS FOR IMPROPER 14 OPINION AND CONCLUSION. YOU CAN ANSWER WHAT YOU KNOW. 15 A. I DON'T KNOW. 16 BY MR. COZAD: 17 Q. SAME THING WITH RESPECT TO TRUSTEE STRATTAN? 18 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTIONS. GO AHEAD. 19 A. I DON'T KNOW. 20 BY MR. COZAD: 21 Q. SAME THING WITH RESPECT TO TRUSTEE SIMON? 22 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTIONS. GO AHEAD. 23 A. I DON'T KNOW. 24 BY MR. COZAD: 25 Q. SAME QUESTION WITH RESPECT TO HENRY HOLLOWAY? 255 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTIONS. GO AHEAD. 2 A. I DON'T KNOW. 3 MR. COZAD: ONE MOMENT. 4 MR. PAGE: THAT'S GOOD. 5 BY MR. COZAD: 6 Q. OKAY. REFERRING NOW TO EXHIBIT 47. DID YOU 7 AUTHORIZE MR. OTTILIE TO SEND THIS LETTER TO COUNSEL FOR 8 THE COLLEGE DISTRICT ON YOUR BEHALF? 9 MR. WINET: LET ME OBJECT. MY CONCERN WITH 10 THAT IS IT'S GETTING INTO THE ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE. 11 IT WOULD DEAL WITH HER COMMUNICATION WITH MR. OTTILIE. 12 MR. COZAD: THE FACT OF REPRESENTATION AND 13 AUTHORIZATION OF COMMUNICATION IS NOT WITHIN THE 14 ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE. 15 MR. WINET: WELL, THE WAY YOU WORDED -- 16 MR. COZAD: WE CAN GET AROUND IT. YOU KNOW WE 17 CAN TIP TOE AROUND IT BUT I'LL TELL YOU RIGHT NOW THAT 18 AIN'T THE LAW. 19 MR. WINET: THE WAY YOU'VE WORDED THE QUESTION 20 IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU'RE GOING INTO THE COMMUNICATION LET'S 21 JUST TRY -- I THINK YOU CAN GO AHEAD THE ANSWER THAT 22 YOU'RE LOOKING FOR LET'S JUST TRY TO REWORD THE QUESTION 23 IF WE COULD. 24 MR. COZAD: ALL RIGHT. 25 MR. WINET: WAS THIS LETTER SENT WITH HER 256 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 AUTHORITY. SOME ALONG THOSE LINES. 2 MR. COZAD: GREAT QUESTION. 3 A. I KNEW HE WAS GOING TO WRITE A LETTER ASKING 4 THE TRUSTEES TO LET THEM KNOW THAT HE HAD BEEN HIRED BY 5 ME AND ASKING THEM TO NOT MAKE ANY PUBLIC EVALUATIONS ON 6 MY BEHALF. 7 BY MR. COZAD: 8 Q. DID YOU GET A COPY OF THIS LETTER ON OR ABOUT 9 MARCH 19, 2007? 10 A. I DID. 11 Q. AND DID YOU APPROVE OF IT? 12 MR. WINET: ONCE AGAIN IT'S VERY CLOSE TO THE 13 ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE. YOU CAN ANSWER THAT QUESTION 14 WITH A YES OR NO. 15 A. YES. 16 BY MR. COZAD: 17 Q. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE'LL MARK AS EXHIBIT 48. 18 (EXHIBIT 48 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 19 BY MR. COZAD: 20 Q. IT APPEARS TO BE AN E-MAIL FROM YOU DATED 21 MARCH 20, 2007 AT 8:27 A.M. SUBJECT STATES "INSURANCE 22 ANALYSIS." 23 DID YOU AUTHOR THE TOP PORTION OF EXHIBIT 48? 24 A. YES, IT LOOKS LIKE I DID, YES. 25 Q. AND IT APPEARS THAT YOU ARE FORWARDING AN 257 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 INSURANCE ANALYSIS PREPARED BY JIM AUSTIN? 2 A. I THINK MR. AUSTIN'S TITLE IS INSURANCE 3 ANALYSIS AS WELL AS MY TITLE IS INSURANCE ANALYSIS. THE 4 SUBJECT REALLY IS THE EMPLOYMENT PRACTICES AND LIABILITY 5 COVERAGES FOR THE DISTRICT AND THE GOVERNING BOARD AND 6 POTENTIAL PERSONAL LIABILITY EXPOSURE. 7 Q. WHEN DID YOU FIRST MEET JAMES AUSTIN? 8 A. OH, I FIRST MET HIM WHEN WE BOTH WORKED AT -- 9 FOR THE LA COMMUNITY COLLEGE DISTRICT AT LOS ANGELES 10 MISSION COLLEGE AND I DON'T RECALL THE YEAR. 11 Q. WHAT'S YOUR BEST ESTIMATE OF WHEN THAT WAS? 12 A. OH MAYBE IF I GO TO ONE OF THE EXHIBITS YOU 13 HAD HERE. I THINK IT'S THE ONE WITH -- WHEN WAS THAT? 14 MR. WINET: ARE YOU LOOKING FOR THE ONE THAT 15 HAD YOUR CV? 16 THE WITNESS: YEAH. 17 MR. WINET: THERE YOU GO. FOUR. 18 A. SOMEWHERE AROUND 1986, 87, 88. 19 BY MR. COZAD: 20 Q. AND YOU WORKED WITH HIM FOR HOW LONG? 21 A. WELL I WAS AT MISSION COLLEGE FROM 1986 UNTIL 22 1991. THIS PAPER SAYS. SO -- OH 1994. I DON'T KNOW 23 WHEN HE LEFT MISSION COLLEGE SO I CAN'T -- SEVERAL 24 YEARS. MAYBE TWO OR THREE YEARS I DON'T KNOW. HE LEFT. 25 I LEFT AND HE LEFT AND I DON'T RECALL WHEN THAT WAS. 258 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. DID YOU CONTACT MR. AUSTIN AS PARTS OF A 2 SEARCH TO FILL A POSITION AT MIRACOSTA COLLEGE? 3 A. I DID. 4 Q. AND SO WERE YOU THE PRIMARY ONE THAT RECRUITED 5 MR. AUSTIN TO COME TO MIRACOSTA? 6 A. I DON'T KNOW THAT. I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO 7 THAT. 8 Q. DOES MR. AUSTIN HAVE AN EMPLOYMENT CONTRACT 9 WITH THE COLLEGE? 10 A. I WOULD IMAGINE HE STILL DOES. HE DID WHEN I 11 LEFT. 12 Q. DID YOU ASK FOR ANY PARTICULAR TERMS TO BE 13 PLACED IN MR. AUSTIN'S EMPLOYMENT CONTRACT? 14 A. I DID. 15 Q. WHAT TERMS DID YOU ASK TO BE PLACED IN THE 16 CONTRACT? 17 MR. WINET: WELL, MY CONCERN NOW IS THE ISSUE 18 OF MR. AUSTIN. ISN'T THIS -- WITHOUT HAVING THE 19 AUTHORITY FROM MR. AUSTIN TO DISCUSS HIS EMPLOYMENT 20 CONTRACT I DON'T THINK THIS WITNESS HAS THE ABILITY OR 21 THE RIGHT TO DISCUSS THAT. 22 MR. COZAD: YOU MAY BE RIGHT. MY -- TELL ME 23 IF I'M WRONG THOUGH. AREN'T EMPLOYMENT CONTRACTS OF 24 EMPLOYEES OF PUBLIC INSTITUTIONS PUBLIC REPORTS? 25 MR. SLEETH: YOU BET YOU BUT THE NEGOTIATIONS 259 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 OF THEM AREN'T. 2 MR. COZAD: OKAY. THAT MAKES SENSE. 3 MR. SLEETH: 53260. 4 MR. COZAD: I BELIEVED YOU BEFORE. 5 MR. SLEETH: OKAY. 6 BY MR. COZAD: 7 Q. SO DID -- DID -- WELL WHO HAS CUSTODY OF MR. 8 AUSTIN'S EMPLOYMENT CONTRACT? 9 A. MIRACOSTA COLLEGE AND MR. AUSTIN I WOULD 10 THINK. 11 Q. OKAY. ARE YOU PERSONAL FRIENDS WITH MR. 12 AUSTIN? 13 A. NO. 14 Q. HAVE YOU SOCIALIZED WITH MR. AUSTIN OUTSIDE OF 15 THE OFFICIAL BUSINESS MEETINGS AND -- 16 A. I DID A COUPLE OF TIMES WHEN I CAME TO 17 SAN DIEGO AND MAYBE A COUPLE OF TIMES AFTER HE WAS HIRED 18 AND THAT'S ABOUT IT. 19 Q. WHO IS JOE MAZZA M A Z. Z. A? 20 A. HE IS THE RISK MANAGER FOR MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY 21 COLLEGE. 22 Q. IS HE EMPLOYED BY MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY COLLEGE 23 DISTRICT? 24 A. YES. 25 Q. OKAY AND THERE ARE REFERENCES IN HERE TO JPA, 260 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 WHICH I UNDERSTAND IS JOINT POWERS AUTHORITY? 2 A. YES. 3 Q. WHAT, WHAT IS THE ROLE THAT JPA PLAYS IN THE 4 RISK MANAGEMENT FUNCTIONS FOR MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY 5 COLLEGE DISTRICT? 6 MR. WINET: OBJECTION MAY CALL FOR IMPROPER 7 OPINION AND CONCLUSION MAY LACK FOUNDATION YOU CAN GO 8 AHEAD TO THE EXTENT YOU CAN. 9 A. I DON'T KNOW THE ACTUAL DETAILS OF IT, 10 MR. COZAD. IT'S ALL WRITTEN UP IN A SPECIFIC CONTRACT 11 BETWEEN THE COLLEGE AND THE JOINTS POWERS AGREEMENT. 12 BY MR. COZAD: 13 Q. DID YOU GIVE ME ANY IDEA WHAT HAVE THEY DO FOR 14 THE COLLEGE DISTRICT? 15 A. WELL THEY DO FROM WHAT I KNOW, THEY DO SEVERAL 16 THINGS. THEY PROVIDE INSURANCE. THEY PROVIDE BENEFITS 17 FOR EMPLOYEES. THEY PROVIDE RISK MANAGEMENT ASSESSMENT 18 AND OTHER SERVICES OF THAT NATURE. 19 Q. DID YOU ASK MR. AUSTIN TO PREPARE THIS MEMO, 20 THE MEMO MARCH 18, 2007, WHICH IS ATTACHED ON THE SECOND 21 PAGE OF EXHIBIT 48? 22 A. I ASKED HIM TO FOLLOW-UP ON THE REQUEST BY 23 BOARD MEMBERS. I DID. I DIDN'T ASK HIM TO SPECIFICALLY 24 PREPARE THIS REPORT BUT I ASKED HIM TO FOLLOW-UP. 25 Q. NOW? 261 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. WITH A QUESTION. 2 Q. NOW THE FIRST SENTENCE OF THE MEMORANDUM SAYS 3 THAT AS A FOLLOW-UP TO A PASSING COMMENT BY ONE OF THE 4 BOARD MEMBERS I HAVE LOOKED INTO RISK MANAGEMENT AND 5 INSURANCE RELATED TO THE POSSIBLE EXPOSURE OF THE 6 DISTRICT AS A WHOLE AS WELL AS TO INDIVIDUALS RESULTING 7 FROM THE VARIOUS EXISTING AND POTENTIAL ACTIONS AGAINST 8 THE DISTRICT AND THE BOARD." 9 NOW WAS THERE A PASSING COMMENTS BY ONE BOARD 10 MEMBER OR WERE THERE OTHER BOARD MEMBERS WHO REQUESTED 11 SOME INFORMATION? 12 MR. WINET: FIRST OF ALL I NEED TO MAKE SURE 13 THAT -- AS LONG AS -- IF IT'S IN A CLOSED SESSION THEN 14 YOU CAN'T ANSWER IT IF IT'S OUTSIDE OF THE CLOSED 15 SESSION THEN YOU NEED TO ANSWER. 16 A. I THINK IT WAS -- MY KNOWLEDGE OF THE REQUEST 17 OCCURRED IN CLOSED SESSION. 18 MR. WINET: YOU'VE ANSWERED THEN. 19 BY MR. COZAD: 20 Q. HOW SOON PRIOR TO THE MARCH 18, 2007 MEMO WAS 21 IT THAT THIS REQUEST WAS BROUGHT UP IN CLOSED SESSION? 22 A. I THINK THAT THE -- IT WAS BROUGHT UP IN 23 SEVERAL CLOSED SESSIONS. AND I DON'T REMEMBER THE 24 TIMES. 25 Q. WHICH BOARD MEMBERS ASKED TO HAVE THIS STUDY 262 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 DONE? 2 MR. SLEETH: OBJECTION, IF IT OCCURRED IN 3 CLOSED SESSION IT'S PROTECTED. 4 MR. WINET: YEAH, I'LL INSTRUCT HER NOT TO 5 ANSWER ON THAT GROUNDS. (MARK). 6 BY MR. COZAD: 7 Q. WAS THE DISCUSSION CONCERNING EMPLOYMENT 8 PRACTICES AND LIABILITY COVERAGES IN CLOSED SESSIONS 9 REFERENCED ON ANY AGENDA POSTED PRIOR TO THE CLOSED 10 SESSION ITSELF? 11 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, MAY CALLS FOR 12 SPECULATION, MAY LACK FOUNDATION. YOU CAN ANSWER WHAT 13 YOU KNOW. 14 A. I DON'T THINK I UNDERSTAND THE QUESTION. CAN 15 YOU READ IT TO ME AGAIN? 16 Q. WELL, YOU WERE RESPONSIBLE FOR PREPARATION OF 17 AGENDAS, MEETING MINUTES AND OTHER ANNOUNCEMENTS 18 RELATING TO BOARD MEETINGS, CORRECT? 19 A. I SUPERVISED MY EXECUTIVE ASSISTANTS WHO 20 ACTUALLY DID THAT YES AND APPROVED THE ISSUANCE OF BOARD 21 AGENDAS AND BOARD MINUTES YES. 22 Q. AND ARE YOU AWARE OF REQUIREMENTS UNDER THE 23 BROWN ACT THAT DISCUSSIONS IN CLOSED SESSIONS MUST BE 24 PROPERLY NOTICED AND AGENDIZED PRIOR TO THE CLOSED 25 SESSION? 263 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MR. COZAD: LET ME OBJECT TO THE QUESTION. 2 FIRST OF ALL, IT CALLS FOR A LEGAL OPINION. SECOND OF 3 ALL, THE QUESTION DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE BECAUSE IT 4 REFERS TO DISCUSSIONS IN THE FUTURE BEING AGENDIZED 5 PRIOR TO THAT. SO THE QUESTION LACKS FOUNDATION. TO 6 THE EXTENT THAT YOU CAN ANSWER IT YOU CAN GO AHEAD. 7 A. I AM AWARE OF THE FACT THAT THE BOARD CANNOT 8 MEET IN CLOSED SESSION UNLESS THERE'S AN AGENDA ITEM 9 THAT CALLS FOR IT PURSUANT TO THE BROWN ACT. AND SO I 10 AM AWARE OF THAT YES. 11 BY MR. COZAD: 12 Q. WERE THE DISCUSSION THAT IS WERE HELD? 13 A. UH-HUH. 14 Q. CONCERNING EMPLOYMENT PRACTICES AND LIABILITY 15 COVERAGES IN CLOSED SESSION WERE THEY AGENDIZED PRIOR TO 16 THOSE SESSIONS? 17 A. I DON'T THINK I SAID. 18 MR. SLEETH: I'M GOING TO OBJECT THAT IT CALLS 19 FOR A LEGAL CONCLUSION. 20 MR. WINET: I THINK IT DOES AND ALSO TO SOME 21 EXTENT IT CAN BE ARGUED THAT IT LACKS FOUNDATION AND 22 ASSUMES FACTS NOT IN EVIDENCE BUT CAN YOU GO AHEAD. 23 A. I DON'T THINK I SAID THAT THERE WAS DISCUSSION 24 ABOUT THIS IN CLOSED SESSION. 25 264 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. WELL THERE WERE COMMENTS OR REQUESTS BY ONE OR 4 MORE MEMBERS OF THE BOARD IN CLOSED SESSION TO DETERMINE 5 THE EMPLOYMENT PRACTICES AND LIABILITY COVERAGES FOR THE 6 DISTRICT SOMETIME PRIOR TO MARCH 18, 2007; IS THAT 7 CORRECT? 8 MR. WINET: NO SHE'S NOT GOING TO ANSWER THAT 9 QUESTION. IT'S A QUESTION ASKED ABOUT WHAT WAS SAID IN 10 CLOSED SESSION. SHE'S NOT GOING TO ANSWER IT. 11 MR. SLEETH: I AGREE WITH THE OBJECTION BUT I 12 HATE US GOING OFF ON THIS SIDE ISSUE WHERE THERE'S A 13 REAL EASY SOLUTION TO THE PROBLEM. (MARK) WHY DON'T YOU 14 ASK HER IF THERE WAS ANYBODY WHO ALLEGED PUNITIVE 15 DAMAGES IN A LAWSUIT AGAINST ANY OF THE BOARD MEMBERS 16 THAT MIGHT KICK UP AN INTEREST IN WHETHER OR NOT THEY 17 WOULD BE COVERED. 18 MR. COZAD: BECAUSE THAT'S NOT MY QUESTION. 19 MR. SLEETH: WELL THEN WE WOULD HAVE AGENDIZED 20 AND MET ON THAT LAWSUIT AND TALKED TO THE BOARD MEMBERS 21 AND THEY WOULD HAVE SAID TWO I HAVE COVERAGE? AND IT 22 WOULD HAVE BEEN WITHIN THE AGENDA. 23 MR. COZAD: THEN WHY PLAY CAT AND MOUSE? 24 MR. SLEETH: BECAUSE YOU'RE ASKING HER INSIDE 25 AND I'M JUST TELLING YOU, THERE ISN'T AN ISSUE HERE BUT 265 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 YOU ARE NOT GOING TO GET AT IT IN THAT DIRECTION. IT 2 WASN'T AGENDIZED OF A DISCUSSION OF COVERAGE UNDER 3 INSURANCE POLICY. IT WAS AGENDIZED AS HATOFF'S 4 LITIGATION WITH PUNITIVE DAMAGES ALLEGATIONS AGAINST THE 5 BOARD MEMBER. 6 BY MR. COZAD: 7 Q. IS THAT HOW IT WAS? 8 A. CAN I ANSWER THAT CONSIDERING THAT IT'S MY 9 KNOWLEDGE -- 10 MR. SLEETH: IT'S HOW IT WAS AGENDIZED. YOU 11 CAN GO SO FAR -- IF YOU'LL AGREE THAT WE'RE NOT WAIVING 12 ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE YOU CAN GO SO FAR AS TO ASK 13 HER IF THIS DISCUSSION AROSE UNDER AN AGENDA ITEM 14 RELATING TO A PARTICULAR ITEM OF LITIGATION. 15 MR. WINET: NO, YOU REALLY CAN'T. YOU REALLY 16 CAN'T GET INTO WHAT WAS DISCUSSED DURING CLOSED SESSION. 17 MR. SLEETH: IF THEY AGREE THAT WE DON'T 18 WAIVE. 19 MR. WINET: CLOSED SESSION. THAT'S THE 20 PROBLEM. 21 MR. SLEETH: I DON'T WANT TO WAIVE THE REST OF 22 THE ATTORNEY-CLIENT. 23 MR. WINET: THE LAST QUESTION DEALT WITH WHAT 24 WAS DISCUSSED IN CLOSED SESSION AND WE'RE NOT GOING TO 25 GO THERE. WE'RE NOT GOING TO OPEN THAT DOOR. 266 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MR. SLEETH: OKAY. 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. IS JIM AUSTIN AN ATTORNEY? 4 A. ARE YOU ASKING ME? 5 Q. YES. 6 A. I DON'T KNOW. I DON'T THINK SO. 7 Q. DOES JIM AUSTIN HAVE SOME TYPE OF EXPERTISE IN 8 THE ANALYSIS OF INSURANCE COVERAGE? 9 A. I DON'T KNOW. 10 Q. DID ANYONE ASSIST -- STRIKE THAT. 11 DID YOU ASSIST IN THE PREPARATION OF THE MEMO 12 OF MARCH 18, 2007? 13 A. NO. 14 Q. DID YOU REVIEW ANY DRAFTS OF THE MEMO OF 15 MARCH 18, 2007 BEFORE THE FINAL WAS PRODUCED? 16 A. I DON'T RECALL. 17 Q. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE'LL MARK AS EXHIBIT 49. 18 (EXHIBIT 49 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 19 BY MR. COZAD: 20 Q. DID YOU AUTHORIZE MR. OTTILIE TO SEND THIS 21 LETTER ON MARCH 30, 2007? 22 A. I DIDN'T SEE THE LETTERHEAD OF TIME BUT I KNEW 23 HE WAS GOING TO MAKE THIS REQUEST, YES. 24 Q. AND YOU KNEW THAT HE WAS MAKING THE REQUEST ON 25 YOUR BEHALF? 267 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. YES. 2 Q. AS YOUR ATTORNEY? 3 DID YOU EITHER DIRECTLY OR THROUGH MR. OTTILIE 4 REQUEST E-MAILS RECEIVED BY ANY OF THE OTHER TRUSTEES 5 NOT MENTIONED? IN OTHER WORDS TRUSTEES OTHER THAN 6 GLORIA CARRANZA, JUDY STRATTAN,? 7 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, MAY CALLS FOR 8 SPECULATION, LACKS FOUNDATION AS TO THIS WITNESS. CAN 9 YOU ANSWER WHAT YOU KNOW. 10 A. I KNOW THAT WHAT'S ON THIS LETTER AS OF 11 MARCH 30TH FROM MY ATTORNEY MR. OTTILIE. THAT'S ALL I 12 KNOW. 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. SO NEITHER YOU NOR YOUR ATTORNEY REQUESTED ANY 15 E-MAILS FROM CHARLES ADAMS? 16 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION LACKS 17 FOUNDATION, CALLS FOR SPECULATION AS TO WHAT HER 18 ATTORNEY REQUESTED. CAN YOU ANSWER TO THE EXTENT THAT 19 YOU KNOW. 20 A. WHAT I KNOW IS WHAT'S ON THIS LETTER OF 21 MARCH 30TH WHICH IS ONLY TRUST TRUSTEE CARRANZA AND 22 TRUSTEE STRATTAN. 23 Q. SO YOU DIDN'T REQUEST E-MAILS FROM THE CAROLYN 24 BATISTE RODOLFO FERNANDEZ AND GREGORY POST? 25 MR. WINET: HE'S ASKING IF YOU DID. 268 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. I DID NOT. 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. YOU DIDN'T ASK ANYBODY TO DO IT ON YOUR BEHALF 4 AS WELL, CORRECT? 5 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION MAY LACK 6 FOUNDATION AS TO WHAT MR. OTTILIE REQUESTED. YOU CAN 7 ANSWER WHAT YOU KNOW. 8 A. IT WAS A DISCUSSION THAT MR. OTTILIE AND I HAD 9 I THINK IT'S ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE IN TERMS OF WHAT 10 WE DISCUSSED. 11 BY MR. COZAD: 12 Q. OKAY. 13 A. THE OUTCOME IS WHAT YOU SEE ON THE LETTER OF 14 MARCH 30TH WHICH IS EXHIBIT 49. 15 Q. ALL RIGHT. DID YOU ASK ANYONE ON YOUR BEHALF 16 TO SEEK COPIES OF E-MAILS FROM THE ACCOUNTS OF CHARLES 17 ADAMS, CAROLYN BATISTE, RODOLFO FERNANDEZ OR GREGORY 18 POST? 19 MR. WINET: THAT WOULD NOT INCLUDE 20 CONVERSATIONS YOU HAD WITH MR. OTTILIE, SO OUTSIDE OF 21 THOSE CONVERSATIONS. 22 A. NO. 23 BY MR. COZAD: 24 Q. WELL LET ME ASK THIS AGAIN BECAUSE I'M NOT 25 INTERESTED IN THE CONVERSATION THAT YOU HAD WITH MR. 269 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 OTTILIE. I'M INTERESTED IN WHETHER YOU AUTHORIZED 2 ANYONE, INCLUDING MR. OTTILIE ON YOUR BEHALF TO SEEK 3 COPIES OF E-MAILS FROM THE ACCOUNT OF CHARLES ADAMS, 4 CAROLYN BATISTE, RODOLFO FERNANDEZ OR GREGORY POST? 5 MR. WINET: THERE WOULD BE NO WAY FOR HER TO 6 ANSWER THAT WITHOUT DISCLOSING ATTORNEY-CLIENT 7 COMMUNICATION, SO I'LL INSTRUCT HER NOT TO ANSWER AS THE 8 QUESTION IS CURRENTLY PHRASED. (MARK). 9 MR. COZAD: YOU'RE MARKING THE INSTRUCTIONS? 10 COURT REPORTER: YES. 11 MR. COZAD: THANK YOU SO MUCH. 12 BY MR. COZAD: 13 Q. OKAY. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE WILL MARK AS 14 EXHIBIT 50. 15 (EXHIBIT 50 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 16 BY MR. COZAD: 17 Q. WOULD YOU LOOK TO THE THIRD PAGE -- CORRECTION 18 FOURTH PAGE? THE ONE THAT LOOKS LIKE AN ENVELOPE. 19 A. OKAY. 20 Q. AM I MISCOUNTING? 21 A. I WASN'T SURE WHAT YOU MEANT. 22 MR. WINET: I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT THAT'S 23 NUMBER -- THAT'S THE FOURTH PAGE. 24 MR. COZAD: THERE IS HOPE IF I CAN COUNT TO 25 FOUR. 270 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. ALL RIGHT. WHAT IS THIS ENVELOPE? WHY DID 3 YOU KEEP THIS? WHY WAS THIS PRODUCED? 4 A. I DID NOT KEEP -- BELIEVE ME IF I COULD IGNORE 5 THIS COMMUNICATION. WHAT YOU HANDED TO ME IS A FAX THAT 6 WENT FROM MY ASSISTANT LORETTA BURKE TO MR. SHINOFF WITH 7 A LETTER DATED APRIL 26 RECEIPT OF ANONYMOUS LETTER. 8 AND IT'S -- I WANT TO POINT OUT THAT THIS -- THE COVER 9 LETTER IS SIGNED BY MY ASSISTANTS I WAS NOT AT THE 10 COLLEGE AT THE TIME THAT SHE OPENED THE MAIL. I WAS AT 11 A CHIEF EXECUTIVE OFFICER'S CONFERENCE IN TEMECULA. SHE 12 IMMEDIATELY -- SHE HAS AUTHORITY TO TRANSMIT THINGS ON 13 MY BEHALF AND SIGN MY INITIALS. THIS IS WHAT SHE DID. 14 SHE THEN WAS -- SHE HAD PUT IT TOGETHER, INCLUDING THE 15 ENVELOPE. SHE USUALLY KEEPS COPIES OF EVERYTHING THAT 16 COMES INTO THE COLLEGE. BUT IN THIS CASE, THE FACT THAT 17 IT WAS A DEATH THREAT LETTER, WAS IMPORTANT FOR HER TO 18 KEEP A COPY OF THE ACTUAL ENVELOPE ITSELF. 19 SHE THEN CALLED ME. WAS VERY AGITATED. SO I 20 DROVE BACK INTO THE COLLEGE. AND BY THEN, I HAD 21 RECEIVED A CALL BY MR. SHINOFF IN WHICH HE SAID THAT THE 22 LETTER REALLY SHOULDN'T GO TO HIM. THE ORIGINAL LETTER 23 WITH THE ENVELOPE THAT THE LETTER SHOULD BE GIVEN TO OUR 24 COLLEGE CAMPUS POLICE. SO I SPOKE TO MY ASSISTANT AND 25 ASKED HER TO PLEASE RETRIEVE THE LETTER FROM THE MAIL SO 271 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 THAT -- AND THEN CALL OUR CAMPUS POLICE SO THAT THEY 2 COULD BE THERE WHEN I ARRIVED. AND WE OPENED THE 3 ENVELOPE WHERE SHE HAD PLACED THE LETTER. WE LOOKED AT 4 THE LETTER. I, ALONG WITH THE CAMPUS POLICE, AND WE 5 FILED A POLICE REPORT. AND THEY TOOK POSSESSION OF THE 6 ACTUAL LETTER AND THE ACTUAL ENVELOPE AND THEN MY 7 UNDERSTANDING IS FROM THERE THEY FORWARDED TO THE FBI. 8 Q. SO THIS LETTER, TO YOUR UNDERSTANDING, WAS 9 TRANSMITTED VIA U.S. MAIL? 10 A. I BELIEVE SO. YES. IT LOOKED LIKE A REGULAR 11 ENVELOPE WHEN I SAW IT. 12 Q. DID YOU ATTEMPT TO DETERMINE WHO SENT YOU THE 13 LETTER? 14 A. NO. 15 Q. DO? 16 A. NO. 17 Q. DID YOU EVER FIND OUT WHO SENT YOU THE LETTER? 18 A. NO. 19 Q. DO YOU CONTEND THAT TRUSTEE CARRANZA, TRUSTEE 20 SIMON OR TRUSTEE STRATTAN PLAYED ANY ROLE IN THE 21 PREPARATION OR SENDING THIS LETTER TO YOU? 22 MR. WINET: LET ME OBJECT. THE QUESTION IS 23 IMPROPER IN THE REFERENCE OF DO YOU CONTEND. IT WOULD 24 BE PROPER TO ASK HER IF SHE HAS ANY KNOWLEDGE OF IT 25 BECAUSE ANY CONTENTION WOULD BE IMPROPER AND ALSO CALLS 272 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 FOR SPECULATION. I'LL ASK YOU TO REPHRASE YOUR 2 QUESTION. IF YOU WON'T THEN I'LL ADDRESS IT AS THE WAY 3 IT IS. 4 MR. COZAD: YOU KNOW I'M HAPPY TO USE YOUR 5 WORD JUST TO GET A GOOD ANSWER HERE. 6 MR. WINET: OKAY. 7 MR. COZAD: SO LET'S DO THAT. 8 A. I HAVE NO KNOWLEDGE OF -- ANY OF THEM 9 PREPARING THIS. 10 BY MR. COZAD: 11 Q. OKAY. DO YOU HAVE ANY KNOWLEDGE THAT EITHER 12 OF THEM INDIRECTLY SOMEHOW CAUSED THIS LETTER TO BE SENT 13 TO YOU? 14 A. I HAVE NO KNOWLEDGE OF THAT. WHAT I DID SAY 15 AT A PUBLIC MEETING AFTER TRUSTEE ADAMS HOUSE WAS 16 VANDALIZED WITH THE K K K I SPOKE TO THE PUBLIC AS A 17 CITIZEN TALKING ABOUT HURTFUL I FELT WITH THE HOSTILE 18 ENVIRONMENT THAT HAD BEEN CREATED AT THE COLLEGE. AND 19 THAT I WAS VERY DISAPPOINTED AND VERY HURT BY THE FACT 20 THAT THE THREE TRUSTEES HAD ENCOURAGED BY THEIR BEHAVIOR 21 TOWARDS ME COLLEGE EMPLOYEES TO REALLY ENGAGE IN A 22 VERY -- I MEAN CREATED A REALLY HOSTILE WORK ENVIRONMENT 23 FOR ME. I COULDN'T WORK I -- BY THE ACTS OF THESE THREE 24 TRUSTEES, STRATTAN, SIMON AND CARRANZA, THEY HAD TAKEN 25 AWAY ANY AUTHORITY, ANY ABILITY FOR ME TO LEAD THE 273 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 COLLEGE AS A COLLEGE PRESIDENT. AND I FELT THAT THEY 2 NEEDED TO TAKE RESPONSIBILITY FOR HAVING CREATED THAT 3 ENVIRONMENT, THAT DID NOT ENABLE ME TO CARRY OUT MY 4 DUTIES AND ENCOURAGE SOMEONE, YOU KNOW SOMEONE FROM THE 5 COLLEGE OR SOMEONE FROM THE PUBLIC AT LARGE, TO HAVE THE 6 AUDACITY TO CREATE THIS AND WRITE THIS LETTER AND SEND 7 IT TO ME. 8 Q. ARE YOU SUGGESTING THAT STRATTAN, SIMON AND 9 CARRANZA ACTUALLY CAUSED SOMEHOW THIS LETTER TO BE SENT 10 TO YOU? 11 A. I DID NOT SAY THAT. 12 Q. DID THEY ENCOURAGE SOMEONE TO SEND THIS LETTER 13 TO YOU? 14 A. I DID NOT SAY THAT. 15 Q. ARE YOU SUGGESTING THAT THEY ARE SOMEHOW 16 RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS LETTER BEING SENT TO YOU? 17 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, CALLS FOR IMPROPER 18 OPINION AND CONCLUSION, LACKS FOUNDATION. AND ALSO 19 CALLS FOR SPECULATION AS YOU WOULD KNOW THAT GO AHEAD. 20 A. I ALREADY SAID WHAT I THOUGHT IN MY EARLIER 21 STATEMENT. 22 BY MR. COZAD: 23 Q. NOW YOU MENTION THAT THEY CREATED SUCH A 24 HOSTILE WORK ENVIRONMENT THAT YOU COULD NOT CONTINUE TO 25 WORK OR SOMETHING TO THAT EFFECT? 274 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. YES I COULDN'T -- IT WAS VERY DIFFICULT FOR ME 2 TO CARRY OUT THE DUTIES OF THE PRESIDENT WHEN, YOU KNOW, 3 EMPLOYEES WERE SAYING THAT THEY COULD NOT TRUST ME, THAT 4 THEY DID NOT BELIEF IN ME AND THEY WERE SUPPORTED BY 5 THESE THREE TRUSTEES WHO WANTED TO CONTINUALLY AND 6 CONTINUALLY AND CONTINUALLY GO OVER THE SAME THING AND 7 SAME THING. 8 Q. WHAT'S THE VERY WORST THING THAT THEY DID THAT 9 LED TO THE CREATION OF A HOSTILE WORK ENVIRONMENT FOR 10 YOU? 11 MR. WINET: OBJECTION. THE QUESTION MAY LACK 12 FOUNDATION. MAY CALL FOR IMPROPER OPINION AND 13 CONCLUSION AS TO WHAT WAS THE WORST THING BUT YOU CAN GO 14 AHEAD. 15 A. WELL LET ME TELL YOU MY FEELINGS AND WHAT I 16 THOUGHT AT THE TIME. 17 MR. WINET: NOW HE'S JUST ASKING A QUESTION. 18 YOU'RE ABOUT TO GO ON WITH A NARRATIVE. HE'S ASKING 19 WHAT WAS THE WORST THING AND YOU SHOULD JUST ANSWER HIS 20 QUESTION. 21 A. WHAT WAS THE WORSE THING IT'S A SERIES OF 22 THINGS. IT WAS NOT ONE SINGLE THING. IT WAS A 23 CONTINUOUS ONGOING ATTACK ON MY CHARACTER AND MY ABILITY 24 TO LEAD THE COLLEGE. IT WAS A CONTINUOUS. IT JUST 25 WOULD NOT SEES. AT EVERY OPPORTUNITY. AT EVERY BOARD 275 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MEETING IN THE PUBLIC SETTING THERE WERE, THERE WERE 2 ATTEMPTS TO CHANGE MY EVALUATION PROCESS, TALK TO THE 3 PRESS AND SAY THAT THEY WERE PUTTING AN AGENDA TO GET 4 RID OF ME FROM THE COLLEGE. ENDORSING THE VOTE OF NO 5 CONFIDENCE WHICH WAS BASED ON RUMORS AND INNUENDO AND 6 GENERALITIES, A VOTE OF NO CONFIDENCE THAT COMES ONLY A 7 COUPLE MONTHS AFTER NOT A SINGLE EMPLOYEE HAD ANYTHING 8 NEGATIVE TO SAY ABOUT ME DURING MY JULY 18TH RENEWAL OF 9 MY CONTRACT. 10 SUDDENLY THE WHOLE THINGS FALLS APART AND I'M 11 A HORRIBLE PERSON. I MEAN IT JUST DOESN'T MAKE ANY 12 SENSE AND THESE THREE TRUSTEES GAVE VOICE TO THAT KIND 13 OF BEHAVIOR AGAINST ME THEY WERE LITERALLY IN MY OPINION 14 MAKING MY LIFE SO MISERABLE THAT I WOULD QUIT. I WOULD 15 JUST LEAVE. I JUST COULDN'T CARRY OUT MY DUTIES AND 16 THEY WERE JUST TRYING TO TRAP ME INTO DOING SOMETHING 17 THAT I WAS NOT SUPPOSED TO DO TO CALL ME ON THE CARPET. 18 THEY SAID NO CAUSE. NOT A SINGLE CAUSE TO CALL FOR AN 19 AGENDA ITEM TO FIRE ME. AND YET, THEY GO TO THE PRESS 20 AND SAY THAT ON MAY 24TH. ON JUNE 2ND, TRUST SEE SIMON 21 GIVES HER INTERVIEW TO THE PRESS SAYING THAT SHE WANTS 22 TO DISCUSS IN THE PUBLIC SETTING THE LETTER THAT THESE 23 FORMER TRUSTEES AND EMPLOYEES HAVE WRITTEN ASKING FOR MY 24 DISMISSAL. IT'S -- IT'S A LOT. IT WAS -- I WAS IN SUCH 25 EMOTIONAL TURMOIL. IT WAS CONSTANT, CONSTANT. I DON'T 276 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 KNOW -- I CAN'T ANSWER ONE QUESTION. I'M SORRY 2 MR. WINET. IT'S A SERIES OF THINGS. 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE THAT THEY DID THAT YOU 5 HAVEN'T ALREADY TOLD ME ABOUT THAT YOU BELIEVE 6 CONSTITUTED THEIR CREATION OF A HOSTILE WORK ENVIRONMENT 7 SO BAD THAT YOU WERE UNABLE TO CONTINUE WORKING FOR THE 8 COLLEGE DISTRICT? 9 MR. WINET: DOES THAT QUESTION INCLUDE THE 10 ITEMS THAT SHE'S ALREADY DISCUSSED TO AND DURING THE 11 FULL DAY OF DEPOSITION ON FRIDAY? 12 MR. COZAD: YES, IT DOES. 13 MR. WINET: OKAY. SO OTHER THAN WHAT'S 14 ALREADY BEEN DISCUSSED. ANYTHING ELSE? 15 A. THERE'S A LOT OF OTHER THINGS THAT I CANNOT 16 DISCUSS BECAUSE THEY HAPPENED IN CLOSED SESSION. AND 17 THERE ARE OTHER THINGS THAT HAPPENED IN CORRESPONDENCE 18 BETWEEN THE TRUSTEES AND THEIR LEGAL COUNSEL THAT I 19 CANNOT DISCUSS. AND -- AND YOU NEED TO CONSIDER MY 20 ATTORNEYS MR. OTTILIE'S LETTER OF AUGUST 15TH THAT 21 DESCRIBES IN DETAIL ALL OF THE THINGS THAT HAPPENED TO 22 ME. 23 BY MR. COZAD: 24 Q. ANYTHING ELSE? 25 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION IS 277 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 OVERBROAD. GO AHEAD. 2 A. I CAN'T THINK OF IT RIGHT NOW. 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. ALL RIGHT. WHILE WE'RE HERE TALKING ABOUT 5 DAMAGES, WERE YOU -- DID YOU SUFFER FROM EMOTIONAL 6 DISTRESS ARISING FROM THE SERIES OF EVENTS YOU'RE 7 TALKING ABOUT? 8 A. I WAS, YES, OF COURSE. 9 Q. AND -- 10 A. I WAS VERY DISTRESSED. 11 Q. AND DID YOU CONSIDER THAT THE EMOTIONAL 12 DISTRESS THAT YOU SUFFERED WAS PART OF THE BASIS FOR THE 13 SETTLEMENT THAT YOU ENTERED INTO WITH THE COLLEGE 14 DISTRICT? 15 A. I THINK THAT EVERYTHING THAT IS OUTLINED IN MY 16 ATTORNEY MR. OTTILIE'S LETTER IN TERMS OF THE DAMAGES IS 17 WHAT WAS CONSIDERED IN THE SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT. 18 BY MR. COZAD: 19 Q. BY THE WAY, WAS THERE AFTER TIME THAT A 20 MAJORITY OF THE BOARD VOTED TO SHOW DISAPPROVAL OF YOUR 21 ACTION AT MIRACOSTA COLLEGE? 22 MR. WINET: OUTSIDE OF CLOSED SESSION. 23 MR. COZAD: WELL IF THEY VOTED IN CLOSED 24 SESSION THEY HAVE TO REPORT IT OUT, RIGHT? MR. BROWN 25 ACT. 278 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MR. SLEETH: HE'S MR. BROWN ACT. IF THEY TOOK 2 ACTION ON THE SESSION THEY HAVE TO REPORT OUT. 3 MR. COZAD: YEAH. 4 MR. SLEETH: UNLESS THERE'S AN ADMINISTRATIVE 5 REMEDY WHICH WOULD CAUSE THE DELAY OF THAT REPORT OUT. 6 BY MR. COZAD: 7 Q. OKAY SO I THINK I GOT A GOOD QUESTION HERE FOR 8 CRYING OUT LOUD. 9 (LAST QUESTION READ.) 10 A. THERE WAS NO VOTE BY THE BOARD, NO. 11 Q. OTHER THAN VOTES BY THE BOARD DID A MAJORITY 12 EVER TAKE ANY ADVERSE ACTION AGAINST YOU IN CONNECTION 13 WITH YOUR EMPLOYMENT FROM JUNE OF 2006 UNTIL THE 14 SETTLEMENT OF JUNE 20TH, 2007? 15 MR. SLEETH: OBJECTION CALLS FOR LEGAL 16 CONCLUSION. VAGUE AND AMBIGUOUS AS TO THE MEANING OF 17 ADVERSE ACTION. 18 MR. WINET: JOIN TO THE EXTENT YOU CAN ANSWER 19 GO AHEAD. 20 A. I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE LEGAL TERM AND THE 21 RAMIFICATIONS OF ADVERSE ACTION IMPLY. BUT FOR A 22 MAJORITY YOU USED THE WORD MAJORITY BOARD, FOR THAT TO 23 BE CREATED, IMPLIES A PUBLIC VOTE AND THAT NEVER TOOK 24 PLACE. 25 279 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. ALL RIGHT. NOW DID YOU SUFFER SEVERE 3 EMOTIONAL MENTAL AND PHYSICAL INJURY AS A RESULT OF THE 4 CONDUCT OF THE COLLEGE DISTRICT AND INDIVIDUAL TRUSTEES? 5 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION IS COMPOUND 6 AND OVERBROAD. YOU CAN GO AHEAD AND ANSWER. 7 A. CAN YOU REPHRASE YOUR QUESTION? I MEAN. 8 MR. COZAD: SURE. 9 A. GIVE ME SPECIFICS AS TO WHAT YOU'RE SEEKING I 10 MEAN YOU'RE READING FROM MY ATTORNEY'S LETTER I SEE THAT 11 THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE READING FROM. 12 Q. LET ME BREAK THE QUESTION DOWN SO WE CAN GET A 13 GOOD ANSWER. SO LISTEN CAREFULLY AND I'LL TRY TO BE 14 VERY CLEAR. DID YOU SUFFER SEVERE EMOTIONAL, MENTAL AND 15 PHYSICAL INJURY AS A RESULT OF THE CONDUCT OF THE 16 COLLEGE DISTRICT? 17 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION IS 18 COMPOUND AND OVERBROAD. YOU CAN ANSWER. 19 A. I SUFFERED ENORMOUS STRESS AND I WAS UNDER A 20 LOT OF EMOTIONAL TURMOIL DURING ALL OF THAT TIME, YES. 21 BY MR. COZAD: 22 Q. ALL RIGHT. DID YOU SEEK ANY MEDICAL CARE FOR 23 THE SEVERE EMOTIONAL MENTAL AND PHYSICAL INJURIES THAT 24 YOU SUFFERED? 25 A. I SPOKE WITH MY OWN PHYSICIAN ABOUT WHAT I WAS 280 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 GOING THROUGH. 2 Q. ANYONE ELSE? 3 A. I SPOKE WITH MY HUSBAND. 4 Q. ANYONE ELSE? 5 A. I SPOKE WITH MR. OTTILIE. 6 Q. ANYONE ELSE? 7 A. I THINK THAT THERE WERE QUITE A FEW COLLEGE 8 EMPLOYEES THAT MENTIONED TO ME THAT I WAS NOT LOOKING 9 WELL, THAT I WAS -- THEY WERE WORRIED ABOUT ME. THERE 10 WERE MY PERSONAL FRIENDS, MY FAMILY THAT WERE CONCERNED 11 ABOUT HOW I WAS LOOKING AND THE EFFECT THAT THE STRESS 12 WAS HAVING ON ME. I DON'T RECALL EXACTLY THE 13 INDIVIDUALS BUT THERE WERE QUITE A FEW PEOPLE. 14 Q. DID YOU CONSULT WITH ANY THERAPIST OR MENTAL 15 HEALTHCARE PROVIDERS WITH RESPECT TO THE SEVERE 16 EMOTIONAL AND MENTAL INJURIES THAT YOU SUFFERED? 17 A. NO. IT IS NOT MY CUSTOMARY ACTION TO DO 18 SOMETHING LIKE THAT. I WOULD NEVER DO THAT, NO. 19 Q. HOW DID THE SEVERE EMOTIONAL AND MENTAL 20 INJURIES THAT YOU SUFFERED MANIFEST THEMSELVES? 21 A. THE SAME WAY THAT THEY WOULD MANIFEST IN 22 ANYBODY UNDER SEVERE STRESS. I WAS NOT SLEEPING WELL. 23 I WAS NOT EATING WELL. I WAS NOT FEELING WELL. I WAS 24 STRESSED. I WAS -- IT WAS VERY DIFFICULT TO MAINTAIN A 25 POSITIVE OUTLOOK. 281 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. ANYTHING ELSE? 2 MR. WINET: YOU'RE ASKING FOR HER MEDICAL 3 CONDITIONS? IF SO I NEED TO TAKE A BREAK TO TALK TO THE 4 WITNESS ABOUT THAT BECAUSE THERE'S A PRIVACY ISSUE. 5 MR. COZAD: I UNDERSTAND. 6 MR. WINET: ALL RIGHT. SO LET'S TAKE A 7 FIVE-MINUTE BREAK. 8 MR. COZAD: OKAY. 9 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: GOING OFF THE RECORD. 10 WE'RE GOING OFF THE RECORD AT 2:29. 11 (RECESS). 12 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE BACK ON THE RECORD 13 AGAIN. 2:37. 14 MR. WINET: WE WERE OFF THE RECORD AND I HAVE 15 BEEN GOING THROUGH A DEBATE IN MY OWN MIND AS TO THE 16 WITNESS'S RIGHT TO PRIVACY VERSUS THE PUBLIC'S RIGHT TO 17 KNOW SO I THINK WE CAN TALK IN GENERALITIES AS FAR AS 18 ITEMS, BUT I DON'T THINK THAT THAT THEN GOES INTO THE 19 ABILITY TO OBTAIN HER OWN PERSONAL MEDICAL RECORDS AND 20 OTHER ITEMS. AND SO I'M GOING TO ALLOW THE QUESTIONS TO 21 BE ANSWERED IN GENERALITIES AS FAR AS THAT GOES, BUT I'M 22 NOT WAIVING HER AND NOR IS SHE WAIVING HER RIGHT TO 23 PRIVACY IN ANSWERING QUESTIONS. 24 MR. COZAD: I UNDERSTAND THIS AREA IS 25 SENSITIVITY AND I'LL TRY TO BE APPROPRIATELY SENSITIVE. 282 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MR. WINET: THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING I THINK 2 YOU'RE ENTITLED TO KNOW THE INFORMATION. THE DEPTH IS 3 ONE THING. SO WHY DON'T YOU GO AHEAD AND KEEP ASKING 4 QUESTIONS AND WE'LL TRY TO HANDLE THEM THE BEST WE CAN. 5 MR. COZAD: OKAY. JUST TRY TO RECAP ONE ISSUE 6 HERE. 7 BY MR. COZAD: 8 Q. YOU DID NOT SEEK THE SERVICES OF A THERAPIST 9 OR MENTAL HEALTH PROVIDER IN CONNECTION WITH THE SEVERE 10 EMOTIONAL AND MENTAL INJURIES REFERENCED ON PAGE 17 OF 11 MR. OTTILIE'S LETTER, CORRECT? 12 A. CORRECT. 13 Q. WHICH SEVERE EMOTIONAL AND MENTAL INJURIES 14 THAT YOU SUFFERED WERE AS THE RESULT OF THE CONDUCT OF 15 THE COLLEGE DISTRICT ITSELF? 16 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THAT IS CALLS FOR A 17 LEGAL CONCLUSION SINCE THE TRUSTEES WORK FOR THE COLLEGE 18 DISTRICT ANYTHING THE TRUSTEES DO IN AND ON BEHALF OF 19 DR. RICHART IS POTENTIALLY THE RESPONSIBILITIES OF THE 20 COLLEGE DISTRICT. SO THE QUESTION CALLS FOR IMPROPER 21 LEGAL CONCLUSION. WITH THAT OBJECTION TO THE EXTENT 22 THAT YOU CAN ANSWER I THINK YOU ALREADY HAVE ANSWERED IT 23 BUT GO AHEAD. 24 MR. SLEETH: I WANT TO JOIN IN THAT I WAS 25 GOING TO SAY SOMETHING ELSE BUT I THINK THAT COVERS IT. 283 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. THE TRUSTEES ARE MY EMPLOYER. AND AS THE CEO 2 OF AN INSTITUTION OR A SENIOR OFFICER OF AN INSTITUTION 3 PARTICULARLY A PUBLIC INSTITUTION, WHAT YOU WANT TO HAVE 4 IS A GOOD RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE CEO AND THE BOARD OF 5 TRUSTEES, NAMELY THE EMPLOYER AND THE EMPLOYEE. THE 6 BOARD OF TRUSTEES HAS ONE EMPLOYEE AND THAT'S THE CEO. 7 WHAT HAPPENS WHEN EMPLOYEES OR EMPLOYEE GROUPS 8 ARE DISSATISFIED OR ANGRY OR UPSET WITH THE CEO IS THEY 9 HAVE A TENDENCY TO MAKE ALL KIND OF DIFFERENT 10 ACCUSATIONS AND FOR THE MOST PART CEOS/COLLEGE 11 PRESIDENTS HANDLE THAT WITH THE UNDERSTANDING THAT THE 12 EMPLOYER AND THE CEO ARE MAKING ALL OF THE DECISIONS 13 THAT AFFECT THE EMPLOYEES IN UNISON AND COLLABORATIVELY. 14 AND THAT'S THE WORK ENVIRONMENT THAT I'M USED TO WORKING 15 IN. 16 WHAT HAPPENED HERE IS THAT SUDDENLY MY 17 EMPLOYER BEGAN TO SIDE WITH A LOT OF THE PUBLIC 18 STATEMENTS AND A LOT OF THE THINGS THAT THE EMPLOYEES 19 WERE SAYING AND FORMER EMPLOYEES WERE SAYING. AND 20 BECAME THEIR ADVOCATES, THUS CREATING A SITUATION WHERE 21 I COULD NOT CONTINUE TO DO MY JOB BECAUSE I WAS 22 CONSTANTLY BEING, IN ESSENCE, HARASSED BY THREE MEMBERS 23 OF MY EMPLOYEE GROUP. WHILE THE OTHER FOUR BOARD 24 MEMBERS, ALTHOUGH THEY ATTEMPTED AND ATTEMPTED AND 25 ATTEMPTED TO BRING THE THREE MINORITY SELF-APPOINTED 284 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MINORITY TRUSTEES BACK INTO ACCEPTABLE BEHAVIORS WITH 2 ITS CEO IT CONTINUED TO DETERIORATE, AND DETERIORATE, 3 AND DETERIORATE. AND THAT'S WHY I THINK HAPPENED IS 4 THAT I WAS BEING HARASSED BY MY EMPLOYER AND I THINK 5 THAT THESE THREE TRUSTEES BY THEIR STATEMENTS AND THEIR 6 ACTIONS WANTED ME TO RESIGN. THEY WERE IN ESSENCE 7 CREATING AN ENVIRONMENT FOR CONSTRUCTIVE TERMINATION AND 8 MAKING MY LIFE MISERABLE SO THAT I WOULD LEAVE. 9 Q. DID CHARLES ADAMS CONTRIBUTE TO THE HARASSMENT 10 THAT YOU DEALT WITH AND THAT YOU JUST REFERRED TO? 11 A. NO. 12 Q. DID CAROLYN BATISTE CONTRIBUTE TO THE 13 HARASSMENT THAT YOU'VE JUST REFERRED TO? 14 A. NO. 15 Q. DID RODOLFO FERNANDEZ CONTRIBUTE TO THE 16 HARASSMENT THAT YOU JUST REFERRED TO? 17 A. NO. 18 Q. DID GREGORY POST CONTRIBUTE TO THE HARASSMENT 19 THAT YOU REFERRED TO? 20 A. NO. 21 Q. SO WHEN YOU WERE REFERRING TO HARASSMENT BY 22 YOUR EMPLOYER, WERE YOU REFERRING TO HARASSMENT BY 23 CARRANZA, SIMON AND STRATTAN? 24 A. THAT'S WHAT I SAID. THE SO-CALLED OR 25 SELF-IDENTIFIED MINORITY TRUSTEES. HOWEVER, WHAT I DID 285 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 SAY ALSO IS THAT AS A GROUP, ALL SEVEN OF THEM BECOME MY 2 EMPLOYER. AND WHAT HAPPENED IS THAT THE FOUR MAJORITY 3 TRUSTEES, ALTHOUGH THEY DON'T LIKE TO CALL THEMSELVES 4 MAJORITY TRUSTEES, THEY JUST THINK THAT THEY ARE THE 5 TRUSTEES AND RIGHTLY SO, COULD NOT STOP THE MINORITY 6 TRUSTEES FROM ENGAGING IN THE BEHAVIOR THAT CREATED THE 7 TURMOIL AND SUED. 8 Q. AND THE BEHAVIOR BEING IN GENERAL IN PUBLIC 9 MAKING STATEMENTS ABOUT YOUR WORK PERFORMANCE? 10 MR. WINET: OBJECTION. THE QUESTION IS 11 INCOMPLETE AND UNDER BROAD. YOU CAN ANSWER. 12 A. THE BEHAVIOR IS WHAT I REPORTED IN MY 13 DEPOSITION LAST -- WHAT WAS IT MONDAY? NO FRIDAY OF 14 LAST. 15 MR. WINET: FRIDAY. 16 A. OF LAST WEEK AND WHAT I HAVE STATED EARLIER IN 17 THIS DEPOSITION TODAY PLUS ONCE AGAIN, ALL OF THE ITEMS 18 THAT ARE OUTLINED IN MY ATTORNEY'S LETTER OF 19 AUGUST 15TH, 2006. 20 MR. WINET: 2007? 21 A. 2007. I'M SORRY. 22 BY MR. COZAD: 23 Q. WELL IT'S A LITTLE BIT OUT OF ORDER BUT BY 24 POPULAR DEMAND WE'LL MARK WHAT APPEARS TO BE ROBERT 25 OTTILIE'S LETTER OF AUGUST 15, 2007 AS EXHIBIT 51. 286 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 (EXHIBIT 51 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. DID YOU SUFFER ANY PHYSICAL INJURIES AS A 4 RESULT OF THE CONDUCT OF THE COLLEGE DISTRICT? 5 MR. WINET: PHYSICAL INJURY INCLUDE PHYSICAL 6 AILMENT? 7 MR. COZAD: OKAY. I'LL GO WITH THAT. 8 MR. WINET: WELL PHYSICAL INJURY IS LIKE 9 SOMEBODY HITTING SOMEBODY. PHYSICAL AILMENT IS 10 DIFFERENT. IT COULD BE CONSIDERED THE SAME BUT I'M 11 TRYING TO CLARIFY IT FOR THE RECORD. I'M TRYING TO GET 12 YOU THE INFORMATION I THINK YOU'RE LOOKING FOR. 13 MR. COZAD: WONDERFUL I SURE APPRECIATE IT. 14 THANK YOU. 15 MR. WINET: SO WHETHER IT'S PHYSICAL INJURY OR 16 PHYSICAL AILMENT. THE QUESTION IS THAT BROAD. 17 A. I THINK THAT I WAS UNDER AN ENORMOUS AMOUNTS 18 OF STRESS AND IT DID AFFECT MY HEALTH. AND I AM A VERY 19 PRIVATE PERSON. I DON'T LIKE SHARING PERSONAL 20 INFORMATION. BUT MR. WINET HAS ASKED THAT IN GENERAL 21 TERMS I TELL YOU THE PHYSICAL EXPRESSIONS OF WHAT I WAS 22 UNDERGOING AND I WAS -- MY BLOOD PRESSURE WAS AFFECTED. 23 MY WEIGHT WAS AFFECTED. MY -- I WAS EXPERIENCING 24 DIZZINESS. I WAS EXPERIENCING SEVERE DIGESTIVE 25 PROBLEMS. I WAS EXPERIENCING AN INORDINATE AMOUNT OF 287 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 TENSION. AND I WAS UNWELL. I SHOULD ALSO ADD THAT 2 AFTER THE RECEIPT OF THE DEATH THREAT I WAS EXPERIENCING 3 AN INORDINATE -- I WAS VERY FRIGHTENED. WHEN I WAS TOLD 4 I NEEDED TO CHANGE MY CAR. WHEN I WAS TOLD I NEEDED TO 5 INSTALL CAMERAS IN MY HOUSE TO MAKE SURE THAT NOBODY 6 CAME TO MY HOUSE WHEN I WAS TOLD TO BE ESCORTED IN AND 7 OUT OF THE COLLEGE WHEN I CAME AND WHEN I WENT. IT WAS, 8 IT WAS, IT WAS NOT -- IT WAS NOT THE LIFE -- I WAS NOT 9 LIVING THE LIFE OF A REGULAR PERSON. I WAS UNDER 10 CONSTANT ATTACKS. CONSTANT. YOU KNOW IF IT WASN'T FROM 11 THE TRUSTEES, FROM EMPLOYEES. AND IT WAS MAKING ME -- 12 FORCING ME TO NOT BE ABLE TO -- TO PERFORM TO THE DEGREE 13 THAT I LIKE TO PERFORM. AND IN SPITE OF IT ALL I KEPT 14 TRYING TO WORK THINGS OUT. I KEPT TRYING TO WORK THINGS 15 OUT. I KEPT TRYING TO WORK THINGS OUT. 16 Q. DID YOU SUFFER ANY CONTACT TYPE PHYSICAL 17 INJURIES AS A RESULT OF THE CONDUCT OF THE COLLEGE 18 DISTRICT? 19 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION IS VAGUE 20 YOU CAN ANSWER IT IF YOU UNDERSTAND THE QUESTION. 21 A. I DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU MEAN CONTACT 22 INJURIES. 23 BY MR. COZAD: 24 Q. SURE. ONE COULD CONCEIVABLY CONSIDER A 25 PHYSICAL INJURY TO BE SOMETHING THAT OCCURS AS A RESULT 288 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 OF A BLOW OR A FALL SOMETHING WHERE SOMETHING CONTACTS 2 YOUR BODY. 3 A. OH NO NO. 4 Q. A PHYSICAL TYPE OF AN INJURY? 5 A. NOBODY HIT ME OR PUSHED ME OR MADE ME FALL OR 6 ATTACKED ME PHYSICALLY, NO. 7 Q. OKAY. NOW, MR. WINET HAS CORRECTLY MADE A 8 DISTINCTION ABOUT PHYSICAL AILMENTS? 9 A. UH-HUH. 10 Q. THAT MAY BE RELATED TO STRESS THAT ONE MIGHT 11 BE UNDER. ARE THE TYPES OF PHYSICAL INJURIES THAT 12 YOU'VE OUTLINED FOR ME IN YOUR MIND RELATED TO THE 13 STRESS AS OPPOSED TO SOME TYPE OF A CONTACT OR A BLOW OF 14 SOME KIND? 15 A. OH NO,. IT'S -- NO CONTACT. THERE WAS NO 16 BLOW. THERE WAS NO PHYSICAL -- NOBODY HIT ME. IT WAS 17 ALL EMOTIONAL. IT WAS ALL STRESS RELATED T WAS ALL THE 18 EMOTIONAL TURMOIL I WAS UNDER. 19 Q. NOW HAVE YOU AT ANY TIME IN YOUR LIFE BEEN 20 TREATED FOR HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE? 21 A. YES. 22 Q. WHEN WAS THE FIRST TIME YOU WERE TREATED FOR 23 HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE? 24 MR. WINET: SEE WE'RE NOT -- WE CAN'T GO HERE. 25 THE WITNESS -- I THINK YOU'VE GOT THE INFORMATION THAT 289 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 SHE HAD PREVIOUSLY. BUT NOW YOU'RE GOING INTO ALL OF 2 HER PRIVACY ISSUES INVOLVING HER OWN MEDICAL ISSUES. 3 AND I'M JUST NOT GOING TO ALLOW TO YOU DO SO UNLESS 4 THERE'S A COURT ORDER REQUIRING HER TO START DESCRIBING 5 ALL OF HER PAST MEDICAL HISTORY. 6 MR. COZAD: OKAY. WELL LET'S MAKE A RECORD 7 THEN. I WILL -- I UNDERSTAND YOU MIGHT OBJECT FROM TIME 8 TO TIME SO. 9 MR. WINET: GO AHEAD. 10 MR. COZAD: I THINK I MADE TO MAKE MY RECORD. 11 MR. WINET: OKAY I'M LETTING YOU KNOW. I 12 WANTED TO LET YOU HAVE THE INFORMATION BUT AT THE SAME 13 TIME TRYING TO PROTECT HER PRIVACY RIGHTS AND IT'S A 14 VERY DIFFICULT LINE THAT WE'RE DRAWING SO. 15 MR. COZAD: I -- 16 MR. WINET: I APOLOGIZE IN ADVANCE BUT I DON'T 17 THINK I'M GOING TO ALLOW YOU TO GO -- I MEAN GENERAL 18 STATEMENTS SURE BUT SPECIFICS I DON'T THINK WE'RE GOING 19 TO GO THERE. 20 MR. COZAD: NO NEED TO APOLOGIZE. 21 MR. SLEETH: I JUST WANT TO ADD THE OBJECTION 22 THAT THE DISTRICT OBJECTS THAT THIS IS OUTSIDE THE SCOPE 23 OF THE COURT'S ORDER FOR INQUIRY. WE -- IN ORDER TO 24 PROVE THAT THIS WAS NOT A GIFT OF PUBLIC FUNDS, WE NEED 25 TO PROVE THAT IT WAS, IT WAS UNDERTAKEN IN GOOD FAITH, 290 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 NOT THE VALUE. THAT THE SETTLEMENT WAS UNDERTAKEN IN 2 GOOD FAITH SO WE DON'T NEED TO GO DEEP INTO DAMAGE. WE 3 NEED TO SHOW SOME DAMAGE. 4 MR. COZAD: I UNDERSTAND THAT'S YOUR POSITION. 5 OKAY. SO MAKING MY RECORD WHEN WERE YOU FIRST TREATED 6 FOR HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE? 7 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION, SAME INSTRUCTION. 8 (MARK). 9 BY MR. COZAD: 10 Q. HAVE YOU EVER RECEIVED TREATMENT FOR 11 DIFFICULTY SLEEPING? 12 MR. WINET: YOU CAN ANSWER -- ARE YOU TALKING 13 ABOUT BEFORE THE EVENTS AT MIRACOSTA COLLEGE? 14 MR. COZAD: YES. 15 MR. WINET: YOU CAN ANSWER WITH A YES OR A NO. 16 A. NO. 17 BY MR. COZAD: 18 Q. HAD YOU EVER RECEIVED -- DID YOU RECEIVE 19 TREATMENT FROM A MEDICAL HEALTHCARE PROVIDER FOR 20 DIFFICULTY SLEEPING AT ANY TIME AFTER JANUARY OF 2006? 21 MR. WINET: THAT WOULD INCLUDE REPORTS TO HER 22 OWN DOCTOR? 23 MR. COZAD: YES. 24 A. I DON'T RECALL. 25 291 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. AND THE -- YOUR -- THE DOCTOR THAT YOU RECEIVE 3 YOUR TREATMENT FROM FOR HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE IS WHO? 4 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION. SAME INSTRUCTION. 5 DON'T ANSWER. (MARK). 6 BY MR. COZAD: 7 Q. DID YOU EVER RECEIVE TREATMENT FOR DIGESTIVE 8 PROBLEMS AT ANY TIME PRIOR TO THE EVENTS LEADING UP TO 9 YOUR SETTLEMENT OF JUNE 20TH, 2007? 10 MR. WINET: YOU CAN ANSWER WITH A YES OR NO. 11 A. I DON'T RECALL. 12 BY MR. COZAD: 13 Q. DID YOU RECEIVE ANY MEDICAL TREATMENT FOR 14 DIGESTIVE PROBLEMS AT ANY TIME AFTER JUNE 20TH, 2000 15 [SIC] 16 A. I DON'T RECALL. 17 Q. DID YOU RECEIVE ANY MEDICAL TREATMENT FOR 18 DIZZINESS PRIOR TO JUNE 20TH, 2007? 19 A. I DON'T RECALL THE DATES. I'M SORRY. 20 Q. DO YOU REMEMBER THAT QUESTION I ASKED YOU A 21 FEW MINUTES AGO I SAID DID YOU RECEIVE ANY MEDICAL 22 TREATMENT FOR DIGESTIVE PROBLEMS AT ANY TIME AFTER 23 JUNE 20TH I SAID 2000 BUT I MEANT 2007? DID YOU 24 UNDERSTAND THAT I MEANT 2007? 25 A. I STILL DON'T RECALL THE DATES. I'M SORRY. 292 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. ALL RIGHT. HAVE YOU EVER RECEIVED ANY MEDICAL 2 TREATMENT FOR FEELINGS OF FRIGHT PRIOR TO JUNE 20TH, 3 2007? 4 A. NO. 5 Q. HAVE YOU RECEIVED ANY MEDICAL TREATMENT FOR 6 FEELINGS OF FRIGHT AFTER JUNE 20TH, 2007? 7 A. NO. 8 Q. HAVE YOU EVER BEEN PRESCRIBED MEDICATION TO 9 CONTROL HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE? 10 A. EVER? 11 Q. EVER? 12 MR. WINET: ONCE AGAIN I'LL INSTRUCT THE 13 WITNESS NOT TO ANSWER IT GOES INTO HER RIGHTS OF 14 PRIVACY. (MARK). 15 BY MR. COZAD: 16 Q. WERE YOU PRESCRIBED HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE 17 MEDICATION AFTER JUNE 20TH, 2007? 18 A. YES. 19 Q. WHEN WAS THAT? 20 A. I DON'T RECALL. 21 Q. WHO PRESCRIBED IT? 22 MR. WINET: DON'T ANSWER THE QUESTION. 23 INVADES YOUR RIGHT TO PRIVACY. (MARK). 24 BY MR. COZAD: 25 Q. WHAT WAS THE MEDICATION THAT YOU WERE 293 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 PRESCRIBED? 2 MR. WINET: OBJECTION. RIGHT TO PRIVACY 3 INSTRUCT THE WITNESS NOT TO ANSWER. (MARK). 4 BY MR. COZAD: 5 Q. WHAT WAS YOUR WEIGHT ON JUNE 20TH, 2007? 6 A. I DON'T RECALL. 7 Q. WHAT WAS YOUR WEIGHT JANUARY 1 OF 2007? 8 A. I DON'T RECALL. 9 Q. WHAT'S YOUR BEST ESTIMATE? 10 A. I DON'T KNOW. 11 Q. DID YOU HAVE ANY WEIGHT GAIN FROM JANUARY 1, 12 2007 THROUGH JUNE 20TH, 2007? 13 A. YES. 14 Q. WHAT WAS THE WEIGHT GAIN? 15 A. I DON'T KNOW. 16 Q. DID YOU SEEK ANY MEDICAL HELP FOR ISSUES 17 RELATING TO WEIGHT AT ANY TIME IN YOUR LIFE? 18 A. NO. 19 Q. AND THAT WOULD INCLUDE AFTER JUNE 20TH, 2007 20 AS WELL, CORRECT? 21 A. (NODS.) 22 Q. YES? 23 A. ARE YOU ASKING FOR MEDICAL HELP? 24 Q. YES. 25 A. NO. 294 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. PAGE: 2 MR. PAGE: THE TRANSCRIPT MAY NOT BE CLEAR ON 3 THE LAST YES I DON'T KNOW. 4 BY MR. COZAD: 5 Q. DID YOU RECEIVE ANY MEDICAL HELP WITH RESPECT 6 TO WEIGHT MANAGEMENT AT ANY TIME IN YOUR LIFE INCLUDING 7 AFTER JUNE 20TH, 2007? 8 A. I THINK I JUST ANSWERED THAT. 9 Q. I KNOW BUT I WANTED TO MAKE IT CLEAR FOR THE 10 RECORD? 11 MR. WINET: GO AHEAD AND ANSWER IT AGAIN. 12 A. NO. 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. DO YOU BELIEVE THAT ANY OF THE MEDICAL 15 CONDITIONS THAT YOU'VE DESCRIBED TO ME ARE RELATED TO 16 ANYTHING OTHER THAN YOUR EMPLOYMENT WITH MIRACOSTA 17 COLLEGE DISTRICT? 18 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, CALLS FOR IMPROPER 19 OPINION AND CONCLUSION MAY LACK FOUNDATION. TO THE 20 EXTENT YOU CAN ANSWER, GO AHEAD. 21 A. I REALLY DON'T KNOW HOW TO ANSWER THAT. I 22 DON'T QUITE UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE ASKING ME. 23 BY MR. COZAD: 24 Q. DO YOU BELIEVE THAT YOUR HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE 25 WAS CAUSED BY ANYTHING OTHER THAN YOUR EMPLOYMENT AT 295 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY COLLEGE DISTRICT? 2 MR. WINET: WELL LET ME OBJECT THE WAY THE 3 QUESTION IS PHRASED. IT'S ARGUMENTATIVE BECAUSE THE 4 WITNESS HAS TESTIFIED THAT SHE HAD HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE 5 BEFORE THAT HAPPENED SO I DON'T SEE HOW SHE COULD 6 POSSIBLY ANSWER THE QUESTION THE WAY IT'S CURRENTLY 7 PHRASED. JUST THE TERM HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE. IF YOU'RE 8 TALKING ABOUT AN INCREASE IN HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE OR 9 DIFFICULTY WITH IT THAT'S ONE THING BUT SHE'S ALREADY 10 TESTIFIED SHE HAD ISSUES WITH HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE 11 BEFORE. SO I'LL ASK YOU TO REPHRASE THE QUESTION. 12 MR. COZAD: SURE LET'S EXPLORE THAT. 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. DID YOU HAVE AN INCREASE IN YOUR BLOOD 15 PRESSURE DURING THE TIME YOU WERE EMPLOYED BY MIRACOSTA 16 COMMUNITY COLLEGE DISTRICT? 17 A. THE LATTER PART OF MY EMPLOYMENT I WOULD SAY 18 YES. 19 Q. DID THE INCREASE IN YOUR BLOOD PRESSURE CAUSE 20 ANY OTHER PHYSICAL SYMPTOMS BESIDES AN INCREASE IN THE 21 BLOOD PRESSURE? 22 MR. WINET: MAY CALL FOR AN IMPROPER OPINION 23 AND CONCLUSION BUT YOU CAN GO AHEAD. 24 A. I AM NOT A DOCTOR SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT WAS 25 CAUSING WHAT. I JUST DIDN'T FEEL WELL. SO COULD IT BE 296 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 THE HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE? YES. COULD THE DIZZINESS BE 2 THE HIGH BLOOD PRESSURE IT COULD BE THAT OR MANY OTHER 3 THINGS COULD BE THE INABILITY TO SLEEP ALL OF THAT. I 4 JUST DON'T KNOW -- I REALLY DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT 5 YOU'RE ASKING, ALL OF THESE QUESTIONS ABOUT MY HEALTH. 6 I'VE ANSWERED EVERYTHING I CAN POSSIBLY ANSWER. AND I 7 JUST DON'T SEE -- I KNOW THAT YOU WANT TO PUT IT ON THE 8 RECORD BUT YOU'RE THEN GOING TO PUT IT IN THE PRESS. 9 AND I THINK THAT YOU ARE -- IN MY PERSONAL OPINION I 10 DON'T THINK THAT YOU'RE ASKING ME ANYTHING THAT'S GOING 11 TO HELP THE CASE PURSUANT TO WHAT THE JUDGE SAID YOU 12 COULD ASK ME. AND -- 13 MR. WINET: OKAY. 14 A. -- IT'S VERY HURTFUL -- 15 MR. WINET: YOU'VE -- 16 A. -- TO GO INTO MY MEDICAL BACKGROUND. 17 MR. WINET: RIGHT. 18 A. I'M A VERY PRIVATE PERSON. 19 MR. WINET: YOU'VE ANSWERED THE QUESTION. 20 A. I'M SORRY. 21 BY MR. COZAD: 22 Q. HOW DID YOUR EMPLOYMENT CAUSE THE CHANGE IN 23 YOUR BLOOD PRESSURE? 24 A. BEGINNING -- AS OF JULY 18TH 2006, MY 25 EMPLOYMENT AT MIRACOSTA WAS PRACTICALLY PERFECT. MY 297 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 EVALUATION ON JUNE 2006 IS PERFECT. THE PUBLIC MEETING 2 WHEN THE BOARD RATIFIES MY CONTRACT IS PERFECT. NOT A 3 SINGLE EMPLOYEE SAYS ANYTHING NEGATIVE. EVERYTHING IS 4 WELL. AUGUST 25TH, VICE PRESIDENT HATOFF IS PLACED ON 5 ADMINISTRATIVE LEAVE. SEPTEMBER 1ST, THE VICE PRESIDENT 6 OF THE ACADEMIC SENATE COMES BEFORE THE BOARD TO SAY 7 THAT THE COLLEGE PRESIDENT IS HORRIBLE AND THE 8 COLLEGE -- THE ACADEMIC SENATE AND THE CLASSIFIED SENATE 9 ARE GOING TO START A SERIES OF SURVEYS TO DETERMINE A 10 VOTE OF NO CONFIDENCE AND THAT THEY WERE READY TO DO A 11 VOTE OF NO CONFIDENCE BUT IF THEY DID THAT, IT WOULD BE 12 A KNEE JERK REACTION TO THE PLACEMENT OF VICE PRESIDENT 13 HATOFF ON ADMINISTRATIVE LEAVE, SO THEREFORE BOTH 14 SENATES WOULD CONDUCT SURVEYS ON THE FEASIBILITY OF A 15 VOTE OF NO CONFIDENCE. AND THEN THEY WILL ISSUE IT. 16 THE NEXT THING I KNOW IS THAT I'M PRESENTED, 17 NOT WITH A VOTE FOR THE ACADEMIC SENATE BUT A 18 DECLARATION OF THE VOTE OF NO CONFIDENCE BY THE FULL 19 TIME FACULTY ONLY, NAMELY, IT IS NOT THE ACADEMIC SENATE 20 AND IT IS NOT THE CLASSIFIED SENATE. IN IT A SERIES OF 21 CHARGES ARE MADE THAT ARE BASED ON IN YOU ENDO ON 22 INTERPRETATION. SOME OF THEM ARE JUST PLAIN OLD 23 INCORRECT STATEMENTS. AND THEN I'M ASKED TO EXPLAIN 24 MYSELF BEFORE ALL OF THE EMPLOYEES ON ISSUES THAT ARE 25 NOT EVEN TRUE. ARE MISINTERPRETATIONS, 298 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MISREPRESENTATIONS OF WHAT HAPPENED. 2 I DO THAT. AND THEN THEY TAKE THE VOTE OF NO 3 CONFIDENCE. AND FROM THAT POINT FORWARD AT EVERY 4 BOARD -- ACTUALLY FROM THE MOMENT THAT VICE PRESIDENT 5 HATOFF WAS PLACED ON ADMINISTRATIVE LEAVE EVERY PUBLIC 6 MEETING OF THE BOARD OF TRUSTEES THERE WERE SPEAKERS 7 SAYING ALL KINDS OF NEGATIVE THINGS ABOUT ME. 8 AS YOU HAVE POINTED OUT IN PREVIOUS EXHIBITS, 9 I HAVE BEEN IN THE PUBLIC EYE WITH EMPLOYEES OR EMPLOYER 10 ORGANIZATIONS ATTACKING ME IN PUBLIC. AS A COLLEGE 11 PRESIDENT YOU MAKE DECISIONS THAT ARE NOT POPULAR 12 SOMETIMES WITH YOUR EMPLOYEES ESPECIALLY IF YOU'RE 13 HAVING TO NOT GRANTS TENURE OR YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE 14 DISMISSALS. THOSE ARE NOT PLEASANT AND POPULAR 15 DECISIONS. BUT USUALLY WHAT HAS HAPPENED IN MY ENTIRE 16 CAREER IS THAT MY EMPLOYER GROUP IS BEHIND ME. I AM 17 WORKING IN TANDEM WITH THE EMPLOYER, WITH THE BOARD OF 18 TRUSTEES WHO MAKES ALL OF THE DECISIONS. 19 IN THIS CASE, WHAT HAPPENED IS COME FEBRUARY, 20 A SPLINTER GROUP NAMED THE MINORITY TRUSTEES DECIDED TO 21 WORK AGAINST ME AS WELL. AND TOOK THE POSITION OF 22 ADVANCING THE CAUSE OF THE EMPLOYEES AND FROM, FROM THAT 23 POINT, FROM NOVEMBER ALL THE WAY THROUGH JUNE, IT WAS 24 CONSTANT, CONSTANT ATTACK ON MY CHARACTER, ATTACK ON MY 25 ABILITY TO LEAD THE COLLEGE, ATTACK ON MY PERSON, AND 299 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BECAUSE OF CLOSED SESSION AND PRIVACY RIGHTS I AM 2 UNABLE -- I AM NOT ABLE TO SAY ANYTHING. AND I'M TAKING 3 ALL OF THIS IN AND ALL OF THESE ATTACKS AND ALL OF THESE 4 ATTACKS AND IT JUST WENT ON A CRESCENDO UNTIL WE REACHED 5 A POINT WHERE -- AND I KEPT TRYING TO WORK IT OUT. I 6 TRIED TO WORK IT OUT. AS FAR AS MAY 17TH MY ATTORNEY 7 WRITES TO THE BOARD SEEKING A MEDIATION. WELL THE THREE 8 MINORITY TRUSTEES COME BACK AND SAY WE DON'T WANTS TO 9 MEDIATE WHATEVER WE WANT TO SAY ABOUT THE PRESIDENT 10 NEEDS TO BE DONE IN A PUBLIC SESSION WHICH IS YOU'RE 11 TALKING ABOUT MY PERFORMANCE. YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT MY 12 JOB. AND THEY KNOW THAT IT NEEDS TO BE DONE IN CLOSED 13 SESSION SO WE REACHED A POINT WHERE THERE IS ABSOLUTELY 14 NOTHING TO BE DONE. THEY DON'T WANT TO WORK. THEY WANT 15 ME OUT. AND THEREFORE WE GET TOGETHER AND WE DECIDED IF 16 YOU WANT ME OUT THIS IS MY CLAIM. AND THIS IS HOW YOU 17 CAN MAKE ME WHOLE. AND THAT'S THAT HAPPENED. 18 MR. WINET: SO IS NOW A GOOD TIME FOR A BREAK? 19 MR. COZAD: YES, SIR. 20 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE OFF THE RECORD AT 21 304. 22 (RECESS). 23 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE BACK ON THE RECORD 24 AND IT IS 220 [SIC] 25 MR. WINET: 320. 300 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: OH I'M SORRY. IT'S 320 I 2 STAND CORRECTED. 3 MR. COZAD: ALL SET? 4 BY MR. COZAD: 5 Q. OKAY. DID YOU INCUR ANY EXPENSES FOR MEDICAL 6 BILLS TO TREAT CHANGES IN BLOOD PRESSURE OR WEIGHT OR 7 SLEEP HABITS AS A RESULT OF THE EXPERIENCES AT MIRACOSTA 8 COLLEGE? 9 A. I AM COVERED BY INSURANCE BY MIRACOSTA 10 COMMUNITY COLLEGE. 11 Q. WHAT, WHAT ARE THE AMOUNT OF THE BILLINGS FOR 12 THE TREATMENT OF THESE CONDITIONS? 13 MR. WINET: OBJECTION CALLS FOR SPECULATION. 14 ANSWER IF YOU KNOW. 15 A. I DON'T RECALL I'M SORRY. 16 BY MR. COZAD: 17 Q. SAME QUESTION WITH RESPECT TO DIGESTIVE 18 PROBLEMS, DIZZINESS AND FEELINGS OF FRIGHT, DID YOU 19 INCUR ANY BILLS FOR MEDICAL TREATMENT FOR THOSE ITEMS? 20 A. I AM COVERED BY EMPLOYEE BENEFITS INSURANCE BY 21 MIRACOSTA COLLEGE. 22 Q. DO YOU KNOW HOW MUCH THE BILLINGS WERE? 23 A. I DON'T RECALL. 24 Q. HOW LONG DID THE CHANGE IN BLOOD PRESSURE 25 LAST? 301 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION IS 2 OVERBROAD AND CALLS FOR SPECULATION THE WAY IT'S 3 PHRASED. IF YOU CAN ANSWER YOU CAN GO AHEAD. 4 A. I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN BY LAST. 5 BY MR. COZAD: 6 Q. HAS THERE BEEN A CHANGE IN BLOOD PRESSURE 7 FROM, SAY, JANUARY OF 2006 TO THE PRESENT WHICH YOU 8 BELIEVE? 9 MR. WINET: OBJECT. 10 MR. COZAD: I'M SORRY. 11 BY MR. COZAD: 12 Q. WHICH YOU BELIEVE RESULTS FROM THE EXPERIENCES 13 AT MIRACOSTA COLLEGE? 14 MR. WINET: WE'RE NOT GOING TO DISCUSS 15 ANYTHING IN REGARDS TO HER MEDICAL CONDITION BEYOND 16 JANUARY -- BEYOND JUNE 20TH OF 2007. SO I'LL INSTRUCT 17 HER NOT TO ANSWER. (MARK). 18 BY MR. COZAD: 19 Q. OKAY. DID YOUR BLOOD PRESSURE CHANGE DURING 20 THE TIME PERIOD OF OCTOBER 2006 THROUGH JUNE 2007? 21 MR. WINET: YOU CAN ANSWER THAT WITH A YES OR 22 NO. 23 A. YES. 24 BY MR. COZAD: 25 Q. HOW DID IT CHANGE? 302 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. IT FLUCTUATED. 2 Q. OVER WHAT PERIOD OF TIME DID IT FLUCTUATE? 3 MR. WINET: ONCE AGAIN THE QUESTION IS 4 OVERBROAD. IN THE WAY IT'S CURRENTLY STATED, I'LL 5 INSTRUCT HER NOT TO ANSWER.(MARK) 6 BY MR. COZAD: 7 Q. DID YOUR WEIGHT CHANGE BETWEEN OCTOBER 2006 8 AND JUNE 2007? 9 A. I BELIEVE I HAVE ALREADY ANSWERED THAT 10 QUESTION PREVIOUSLY. 11 Q. HOW DID IT CHANGE? 12 A. IT INCREASED. 13 Q. BY HOW MUCH? 14 A. I DON'T KNOW. 15 Q. HOW LONG DID THE INCREASE LAST? 16 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION, SAME INSTRUCTION. 17 (MARK). 18 A. I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN BY LAST. 19 MR. WINET: SAME INSTRUCTION. 20 A. INSTRUCTION DON'T ANSWER. 21 MR. WINET: THAT'S RIGHT. 22 A. SORRY. 23 BY MR. COZAD: 24 Q. HOW DID YOUR SLEEP HABITS CHANGE BETWEEN 25 OCTOBER 2006 AND JUNE 2007? 303 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. I WAS HAVING DIFFICULTY SLEEPING. 2 Q. HOW LONG WAS IT THAT YOU HAD DIFFICULTY 3 SLEEPING? 4 MR. WINET: BASED UPON THE WORDING OF THE 5 QUESTION I'LL INSTRUCT YOU NOT TO ANSWER. (MARK). 6 BY MR. COZAD: 7 Q. DO YOU CONTINUE TO HAVE DIFFICULTY SLEEPING? 8 MR. WINET: SAME. 9 BY MR. COZAD: 10 Q. WHICH YOU BELIEVE IS RELATED TO YOUR 11 EXPERIENCE AT MIRACOSTA COLLEGE? 12 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION, SAME INSTRUCTION 13 AS TO HER CURRENT MEDICAL STATE. (MARK). 14 BY MR. COZAD: 15 Q. DO YOU BELIEVE YOU HAVE A PERMANENT CHANGE IN 16 YOUR SLEEP HABITS ARISING FROM YOUR EXPERIENCE AT 17 MIRACOSTA COLLEGE? 18 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION, SAME INSTRUCTION. 19 (MARK). 20 BY MR. COZAD: 21 Q. DO YOU BELIEVE YOU HAVE A PERMANENT WEIGHT 22 CHANGE AS A RESULT OF YOUR EXPERIENCE AT MIRACOSTA 23 COLLEGE? 24 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION, SAME INSTRUCTION. 25 (MARK). 304 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. DO YOU BELIEVE YOU HAVE A PERMANENT CHANGE IN 3 BLOOD PRESSURE BASED ON YOUR EXPERIENCE AT MIRACOSTA? 4 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION, SAME INSTRUCTION. 5 BY MR. COZAD: 6 Q. DO YOU BELIEVE YOU HAVE A PERMANENT CHANGE 7 DIGESTIVE FUNCTION? 8 MR. WINET: SAME. 9 BY MR. COZAD: 10 Q. AS A RESULT OF YOUR EXPERIENCE AT MIRACOSTA? 11 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION, SAME INSTRUCTION. 12 (MARK). 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. DO YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU WILL SUFFER DIZZINESS 15 ON A PERMANENT BASIS? 16 MR. WINET: SAME. 17 BY MR. COZAD: 18 Q. BASED ON YOUR EXPERIENCE AT MIRACOSTA? 19 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION, SAME INSTRUCTION 20 (MARK). 21 BY MR. COZAD: 22 Q. DO YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU WILL CONTINUE TO 23 SUFFER FEELINGS OF FRIGHT BECAUSE OF YOUR EXPERIENCE AT 24 MIRACOSTA? 25 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION, SAME INSTRUCTION. 305 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 (MARK). 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. WHAT WAS THE RESULT OF THE LAWSUIT BROUGHT BY 4 THE THREE INSTRUCTORS AT CASCADIA ARISING FROM THE 5 TENURE DETERMINATIONS THAT WERE BEING MADE WHILE YOU 6 WERE THERE? 7 A. I DON'T RECALL THE PRECISE -- THERE WERE 8 SEVERAL ELEMENTS TO THE LAWSUIT. WHAT I DO RECALL 9 BECAUSE OF THE TIMING OF IT IS THAT WHEN THE VISITING 10 TEAM FROM MIRACOSTA WAS AT CASCADIA, WE RECEIVED THE 11 RULING BY THE COURT, THE LAST RULING BY THE COURT AND 12 THE COLLEGE HAD PREVAILED. 13 Q. DID THE COURT MAKE ANY FINDINGS IN CONNECTION 14 WITH THE EVENTS THAT WERE SUBJECT OF THE LAWSUIT IN 15 CASCADIA? 16 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, LACK OF FOUNDATION AS 17 TO THIS WITNESS. MAY CALL FOR SPECULATION. GO AHEAD 18 AND ANSWER WHAT YOU KNOW. 19 A. I DON'T RECALL AT ALL. 20 BY MR. COZAD: 21 Q. WERE THERE ANY ALLEGATIONS THAT THE BOARD -- 22 AT CASCADIA VIOLATED THE STATE'S OPEN MEETINGS ACT? 23 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, CALLS FOR SPECULATION. 24 MAY LACK FOUNDATION AS TO THIS WITNESS. YOU CAN ANSWER 25 WHAT YOU KNOW. 306 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. I DON'T RECALL THE FULL LAWSUIT, MR. COZAD. 2 IF YOU HAVE A DOCUMENT THAT I COULD REVIEW AND LOOK AT, 3 I'LL BE HAPPY TO DO SO. IT WAS DISMISSED. THE COLLEGE 4 PREVAILED. AND I DIDN'T -- I DON'T RETAIN THE 5 INFORMATION. I'M SORRY. 6 BY MR. COZAD: 7 Q. DID THE DISTRICT PAY MONEY TO ANY OF THE 8 PLAINTIFFS IN THE CASCADIA CASE? 9 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, LACK OF FOUNDATION AS 10 TO WHAT THIS WITNESS MAY CALL FOR SPECULATION YOU MAY 11 ANSWER WHAT YOU KNOW. 12 A. THE DISTRICT DID NOT. 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. DID ANY PARTY PAY MONEY TO THE -- ANY OF THE 15 PLAINTIFFS IN THE LAWSUIT AT CASCADIA? 16 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTIONS YOU CAN ANSWER TO 17 THE EXTENT YOU CAN. 18 A. I DON'T RECALL THAT ANYBODY PAID ANYTHING TO 19 THE PARTIES IN RELATION TO THE LAWSUIT. NO, I DON'T 20 RECALL THAT. 21 BY MR. COZAD: 22 Q. IN WHAT MANNER WAS THE CASE DISMISSED IN 23 CASCADIA? 24 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION LACKS 25 FOUNDATION AS TO THIS WITNESS. CALLS FOR SPECULATION. 307 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 YOU CAN ANSWER TO THE EXTENT YOU KNOW. 2 A. I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN MANNER. 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. WAS THE CASE DISMISSED AS A RESULT OF SOME 5 KIND OF FINDING ON THE MERITS BY A JUDGE? 6 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION LACKS 7 FOUNDATION CALLS FOR A LEGAL OPINION. CALLS FOR 8 SPECULATION ON BEHALF OF THIS WITNESS. YOU CAN ANSWER 9 WHAT YOU KNOW. 10 A. I DON'T KNOW. 11 BY MR. COZAD: 12 Q. WAS THE CASE DISMISSED BECAUSE A CASH PAYMENT 13 WAS MADE TO THE PLAINTIFFS? 14 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTIONS. YOU CAN ANSWER 15 TO THE EXTENT YOU CAN. 16 A. I DON'T KNOW. 17 BY MR. COZAD: 18 Q. WAS THERE A FINDING IN THE CASCADIA CASE THAT 19 THE BOARD AND YOU VIOLATED THE OPEN MEETING ACT OF THE 20 STATE OF WASHINGTON? 21 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION IS NOT 22 REASONABLY CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF 23 ADMISSIBLE EVIDENCE IN THIS ACTION. FURTHER IT LACKS 24 FOUNDATION AS TO THIS WITNESS'S KNOWLEDGE AND CALLS FOR 25 SPECULATION. YOU CAN ANSWER WHAT YOU KNOW. 308 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. I DON'T RECALL. 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. HAVE YOU ATTEMPTED TO SEEK EMPLOYMENT ANYWHERE 4 SINCE JUNE 20TH, 2007? 5 A. NO. 6 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION LACKS 7 FOUNDATION -- 8 THE WITNESS: I'M SORRY. 9 MR. WINET: -- AND IT ASSUMES THAT THE WITNESS 10 IS NOT ALREADY BEING EMPLOYED AT THE PRESENT TIME. YOU 11 CAN ANSWER. 12 THE WITNESS: SORRY. 13 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: YOU HAVE FIVE MINUTES. 14 BY MR. COZAD: 15 Q. DID YOU SUBMIT A GOVERNMENT TORT CLAIM AGAINST 16 THE MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY COLLEGE DISTRICT BASED ON THE 17 CALIFORNIA GOVERNMENT CODE? 18 MR. SLEETH: OBJECTION, CALLS FOR A LEGAL 19 CONCLUSION. 20 MR. WINET: I'LL JOIN. YOU CAN ANSWER. 21 A. I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN BY -- I DON'T KNOW 22 WHAT THE GOVERNMENT CODE MEANS AND WHAT YOU HAVE IS WHAT 23 I'VE FORWARDED MY -- THE LETTER FROM MY ATTORNEY MR. 24 OTTILIE CONSTITUTES MY CLAIM. 25 309 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. HOW LONG HAVE YOU BEEN A COLLEGE 3 ADMINISTRATOR, HOW MANY YEARS? 4 A. ADMINISTRATOR? 5 Q. YES. 6 A. OH. MAYBE ABOUT 30 YEARS OR SO. 7 Q. OKAY. AND AS PART OF YOUR DUTIES DURING THAT 8 30 YEARS YOU ASSISTED YOUR VARIOUS EMPLOYERS IN THE 9 DEFENSE OF CLAIMS BROUGHT BY FACULTY AND STAFF AGAINST 10 THE DISTRICTS FROM TIME TO TIME, HAVEN'T YOU? 11 A. NOT NECESSARILY IN THE DEFENSE OF CLAIMS, BUT 12 IN VARIOUS LEGAL ACTIONS. 13 Q. AND YOU ARE FAMILIAR, AREN'T YOU, WITH THE 14 REQUIREMENTS THAT A TORT CLAIM AGAINST A GOVERNMENTAL 15 AGENCY INCLUDING THE COLLEGE DISTRICT MUST BE MADE IN 16 WRITING PURSUANT TO PROVISIONS OF THE CALIFORNIA 17 GOVERNMENT CODE, AREN'T YOU? 18 A. NO, ACTUALLY I'M NOT. 19 Q. OKAY. 20 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: ONE MINUTE TO CHANGE THE 21 TAPE. 22 BY MR. COZAD: 23 Q. DOES THE TERM GOVERNMENT TORT CLAIM HAVE ANY 24 MEANING TO YOU AS AN ADMINISTRATOR WITH 30 YEARS 25 EXPERIENCE? 310 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. YES. 2 MR. COZAD: WE'RE GOING TO TAKE A BREAK AND 3 THEN I'LL ASK YOU WHAT THAT MEANING IS. 4 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: GOING OFF THE RECORD. IT 5 IS 335. 6 (RECESS). 7 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE BACK ON THE RECORD 8 AND IT'S 337. I'M SORRY FALSE START. TOO MANY BUTTONS. 9 ALL RIGHT NAH WE'RE BACK ON RECORD AND IT'S 337. 10 BY MR. COZAD: 11 Q. WHAT DOES THE TERM GOVERNMENT TORT CLAIM MEAN 12 TO YOU? 13 A. IT MEANS A CLAIM MADE BY AN EMPLOYEE FOR 14 WRONGFUL ACTIONS BY THE EMPLOYER. 15 Q. WHAT TIME LIMITS ARISE FROM THE SUBMISSION OF 16 A GOVERNMENT TORT CLAIM? 17 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, CALLS FOR LEGAL 18 CONCLUSION AND A LEGAL OPINION. MAY LACK FOUNDATION AS 19 TO THIS WITNESS. GO AHEAD AND ANSWER WHAT YOU KNOW. 20 A. I UNDERSTAND THAT IT'S ABOUT SIX MONTHS FROM 21 THE ONSET OF A PARTICULAR EVENT. 22 BY MR. COZAD: 23 Q. AND WHAT HAPPENS DURING THAT SIX MONTH PERIOD? 24 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION IS VAGUE 25 AND OVERBROAD. ANSWER IF YOU CAN. 311 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. I'M NOT SURE WHAT YOU ARE ASKING ME. 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. ALL RIGHT. WHEN YOU SAID -- WHICH LETTER IS 4 IT THAT YOU BELIEVE CONSTITUTES YOUR GOVERNMENT TORT 5 CLAIM? 6 A. I DIDN'T SAY THAT I HAVE A LETTER THAT 7 CONSTITUTES MY GOVERNMENT TORT CLAIM. I SAID THAT MR. 8 OTTILIE'S LETTER OF AUGUST 15 OUTLINES MY CLAIM. 9 Q. IS THERE A WRITING THAT YOU BELIEVE 10 CONSTITUTES A GOVERNMENT TORT CLAIM THAT WAS SUBMITTED 11 TO THE MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY COLLEGE DISTRICT? 12 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION CALLS FOR 13 AN IMPROPER OPINION AND CONCLUSION. MAY LACK FOUNDATION 14 AS TO THIS WITNESS. YOU CAN ANSWER TO THE EXTENT THAT 15 YOU CAN. 16 A. I DO KNOW THAT A LEGAL BRIEF WAS PRESENTED TO 17 JUDGE MOON BOTH ON JUNE 8TH AND ON JUNE 19TH. 18 BY MR. COZAD: 19 Q. DID YOU PRODUCE THE LEGAL BRIEF THAT WAS 20 PRESENTED TO JUDGE MOON? 21 A. I DID NOT PRODUCE IT, NO. 22 Q. HAVE YOU SEEN THE LEGAL BRIEF THAT WAS 23 SUBMITTED TO JUDGE MOON? 24 A. I HAVE. 25 Q. DO YOU KNOW WHERE THE LEGAL BRIEF IS 312 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 CURRENTLY? WHO HAS CUSTODY OF IT? 2 A. I BELIEVE MY ATTORNEY MR. OTTILIE HAS CUSTODY 3 OF IT. 4 Q. IS IT YOUR UNDERSTANDING THAT THE LEGAL BRIEF 5 THAT WAS GIVEN TO JUDGE MOON CONSTITUTES THE GOVERNMENT 6 TORT CLAIM ON YOUR BEHALF PURSUANT TO THE CALIFORNIA 7 GOVERNMENT CODE? 8 MR. WINET: OBJECTION CALLS FOR IMPROPER LEGAL 9 OPINION AND LEGAL CONCLUSION LACKS FOUNDATION AS TO THIS 10 WITNESS. YOU CAN TESTIFY AS TO WHAT YOU KNOW. 11 A. WHAT I DO KNOW IS THAT WE PRESENTED A LEGAL 12 BRIEF THAT OUTLINED MY CLAIMS. 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. HAVE YOU AUTHORIZED ANYONE TO DISCLOSE THE 15 MEDIATION BRIEF GIVEN TO JUDGE MOON? 16 A. NO, I HAVE NOT. 17 Q. WHY NOT? 18 MR. WINET: OBJECTION ATTORNEY-CLIENT 19 PRIVILEGE. YOU CANNOT DISCUSS ANYTHING INVOLVING YOUR 20 ATTORNEYS, SO IF THERE IS ANY INFORMATION OR DISCUSSION 21 OUTSIDE YOUR ATTORNEYS YOU CAN ANSWER THAT QUESTION. IF 22 EVERYTHING IS RELATED TO YOUR ATTORNEYS, THEN YOU CAN'T. 23 A. (SHAKES HEAD.). 24 BY MR. COZAD: 25 Q. YOU HAVE NO REASON WHY YOU'VE NOT PRODUCED THE 313 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MEDIATION BRIEF GIVEN TO JUDGE MOON OTHER THAN WHAT YOUR 2 LAWYER TOLD YOU TO DO? 3 A. I DIDN'T SAY I HAVE NO REASON. 4 MR. WINET: YEAH. 5 A. YOU DIDN'T ASK ME THAT. 6 MR. WINET: WAIT HOLD IT HOLD IT. 7 MR. COZAD: OKAY. 8 MR. WINET: THE QUESTION IS ARGUMENTATIVE. 9 DOCUMENTS SUBMITTED AT THE TIME OF MEDIATION ARE 10 OBVIOUSLY PROTECTED BY THE MEDIATION PRIVILEGE. OUR 11 OFFICE IS THE ONES THAT PREPARED THE DOCUMENTS IN 12 RESPONSE TO YOUR DEMAND FOR PRODUCTION OF DOCUMENTS 13 DOCUMENTS SUBMITTED AT THE TIME OF MEDIATION ARE 14 PROTECTED BY THE MEDIATION PRIVILEGE. THAT'S NOT A 15 DECISION THIS WITNESS MAKES. IT'S A DECISION HER LAWYER 16 MR. OTTILIE AND MYSELF MAKE. 17 BY MR. COZAD: 18 Q. CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG BUT GOVERNMENT TORT 19 CLAIMS ARE PUBLIC DOCUMENTS AREN'T THEY? 20 MR. WINET: YES, THEY ARE. OKAY. AND SHE'S 21 SAYING THAT THIS MEDIATION BRIEF IS A GOVERNMENT TORT 22 CLAIM. 23 MR. WINET: THAT'S NOT WHAT SHE SAID. 24 MR. COZAD: OKAY. 25 A. THAT'S NOT WHAT I SAID. 314 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. OKAY SO LET'S BE CLEAR THEN. MAYBE YOU SAID 3 IT I JUST DIDN'T HEAR IT RIGHT? 4 A. OKAY. 5 Q. BUT THE BRIEF GIVEN TO JUDGE MOON IS NOT A 6 GOVERNMENT TORT CLAIM? 7 MR. WINET: OBJECTION CALLS FOR IMPROPER 8 OPINION AND CONCLUSION ON BEHALF OF THIS WITNESS. TO 9 THE EXTENT YOU CAN ANSWER YOU CAN GO AHEAD. 10 A. WHAT I SAID IS THAT WE -- YOU KNOW, A BRIEF, A 11 LEGAL BRIEF WAS PRESENTED TO JUDGE MOON. 12 BY MR. COZAD: 13 Q. OKAY. DO YOU BELIEVE THAT THE LETTER OF 14 AUGUST 15, 2007 BY ROBERT OTTILIE CONSTITUTES A 15 GOVERNMENT TORT CLAIM PURSUANT TO THE GOVERNMENT *CODE? 16 MR. SLEETH: OBJECTION, CALLS FOR SPECULATION. 17 MR. WINET: YES, IT DOES AND LACKS FOUNDATION 18 AS TO THIS WITNESS AS TO WHAT IS AND WHAT IS NOT A 19 GOVERNMENT TORT CLAIM. YOU CAN ANSWER TO THE EXTENT YOU 20 KNOW. 21 A. I THINK SO BUT I AM NOT -- I DON'T KNOW THE 22 LEGAL REQUIREMENTS. I DON'T KNOW ALL OF THE LEGAL 23 REQUIREMENTS OF A TORT CLAIM. BUT IT SPECIFIES -- IT 24 DESCRIBES WHAT OCCURRED WHAT MY CLAIM WAS AND THEN THE 25 SUBSEQUENT ACTION BY THE THREE MINORITY TRUSTEES WHEN 315 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 THEY HELD THEIR PRESS CONFERENCE ON JUNE 27TH. AND THE 2 POTENTIAL EFFECT IT HAD. 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. MR. OTTILIE MAKES A REFERENCE ON PAGE FOUR OF 5 HIS LETTER AT THE VERY TOP THAT WHEN YOU ARRIVED AT THE 6 COMMUNITY COLLEGE IN AUGUST OF 2004 YOU FOUND THAT THE 7 FORMER PRESIDENT HAD LEFT A TOTALLY EMPTY OFFICE. WHO 8 WAS THE FORMER PRESIDENT? 9 A. DR. TIM DONG. 10 Q. AND DID YOU ASK OR DID YOU ATTEMPT TO 11 DETERMINE WHERE THE FILES THAT YOU EXPECTED TO BE THERE 12 WERE? 13 A. I ASKED THE STAFF AND THEY BASICALLY SAID THAT 14 DR. DONG HAD TAKEN THEM ALL WITH HIM. 15 Q. WHAT WERE THE FILES? 16 A. I DON'T KNOW. I DIDN'T SEE THEM. THEY WERE 17 GONE. 18 Q. WHAT FILES DID YOU EXPECT TO SEE? 19 A. WELL, USUALLY YOU HAVE THE FILES OF ONGOING 20 DISCUSSIONS THAT ARE TAKING PLACE AT THE COLLEGE, 21 EMPLOYEE MATTERS, YOU KNOW, THE COLLEGE WAS AT THE TIME 22 I WAS HANDLING A HANDFUL OF -- SEVERAL LITIGATIONS WITH 23 SOME EMPLOYEES AND SOME DISMISSAL CASES AND SOME OTHER 24 LEGAL MATTERS AND THE STAFF WOULD SAY WELL I SUBMITTED 25 THIS TO DR. DONG AND DO YOU HAVE IT. AND NOWHERE TO BE 316 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 SEEN, NOWHERE TO BE FOUND SO THE -- MY OFFICE -- ALL OF 2 THE FILE CABINETS WERE COMPLETELY EMPTY. THERE WAS 3 NOTHING THERE. MY EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT NOTED THAT MOST 4 OF EVERYTHING WAS THEN REFERRED TO THE VICE PRESIDENTS 5 AND THAT THEY HELD ALL OF THE FILES BUT IN THIS CASE 6 ESPECIALLY IN HR CASES THAT WAS NOT THE CASE. 7 Q. DID YOU CONTACT DR. DONG TO SEEK RETURN OF THE 8 FILES THAT YOU EXPECTED TO SEE THERE? 9 A. NO, I DID NOT. 10 Q. DID YOU ASK ANYONE ELSE TO DO THAT ON YOUR 11 BEHALF? 12 A. NO, I DID NOT. 13 Q. NOW THE NEXT PARAGRAPH MR. OTTILIE STATES THAT 14 WHEN THE NEW VICE PRESIDENT OF BUSINESS ARRIVED ON 15 CAMPUS IN SPRING OF 2007 HE LEARNED THAT THE FORMER 16 PRESIDENT, LIKE THE FORMER PRESIDENT HAD REMOVED ALL OF 17 THE FILES FROM HIS OFFICE. WHO IS THE NEW VICE 18 PRESIDENT OF BUSINESS THAT HE'S REFERRING TO? 19 A. MR. AUSTIN. 20 Q. AND WHO WAS THE FORMER VICE PRESIDENT THAT 21 HE'S REFERRING TO? 22 A. MR. ED COATE, DR. COAT. 23 Q. WOULD YOU SPELL THE LAST NAME, PLEASE. 24 A. C-O-A-T-E. 25 Q. DID YOU EVER ATTEMPT TO CONTACT MR. COATE TO 317 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 DETERMINE WHAT HAPPENED TO HIS FILES? 2 A. NO, I DID NOT. 3 Q. DID MR. AUSTIN, TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE CONTACT MR. 4 COATE TO DETERMINE WHAT HAPPENED TO THE FILES? 5 A. I DON'T KNOW. 6 Q. DO YOU KNOW OF ANYONE WHO CONTACTED MR. COATE 7 TO SEEK RETURN OF THE FILES THAT WERE NOT SEEN IN THE 8 SPRING OF 2007? 9 A. NO, I DON'T KNOW. 10 11 Q. ISN'T IS IT TRUE THAT FROM TIME TO TIME THE 12 BOARD TOOK UP ISSUES RELATING TO PALM TREE SALES IN THE 13 HORTICULTURE DEPARTMENT FROM 2001 THROUGH 2006? 14 MR. WINET: I'M SORRY. I MISSED. 15 MR. SLEETH: OBJECTION LACKS FOUNDATION. 16 MR. WINET: I MISSED THE QUESTION. COULD I 17 HAVE IT READ BACK, PLEASE. 18 MR. COZAD: YES, LET'S READ IT BACK. 19 (LAST QUESTION READ.) 20 MR. WINET: SEE THAT'S THROUGH THE END OF 21 2006? THAT'S THE WAY I'LL INTERPRET IT. 22 MR. COZAD: OKAY. 23 A. I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THE BOARD DID IN TERMS OF 24 PALM TREE SALES PRIOR TO MY ARRIVAL. THE BOARD DID TAKE 25 NOTICE IN 2006 OF WHAT WAS HAPPENING IN THE HORTICULTURE 318 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 DEPARTMENT AS A RESULT OF THE WHISTLEBLOWER COMPLAINT. 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. WHO WAS THE WHISTLEBLOWER? 4 MR. SLEETH: OBJECTION, EMPLOYEE PRIVACY. 5 MR. WINET: I THINK -- 6 MR. SLEETH: WELL I JUST SAID IT NOW LET'S 7 THINK ABOUT IT. 8 MR. COZAD: THERE YOU GO. 9 MR. WINET: THE REASON I'M PAUSING IS BECAUSE 10 I BELIEVE THAT IT'S ALREADY BEEN MADE PUBLIC THROUGH THE 11 WHISTLEBLOWER'S CROSS-COMPLAINT IN THE CASE. 12 MR. SLEETH: I THINK IT HAS. 13 MR. WINET: IT HAS. BECAUSE I'VE DEFENDED THE 14 LAWSUIT. SO I THINK SHE CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION. 15 MR. SLEETH: YEAH, OKAY. I JUST -- I HEAR 16 THOSE QUESTIONS AND I JUST REMEMBER THE DISTRICT HAS AN 17 OBLIGATION TO PROTECT THE PRIVACY OKAY. 18 A. MR. RIGS. 19 BY MR. COZAD: 20 Q. YOU WERE NOT THE WHISTLEBLOWER WITH RESPECT TO 21 THE PALM TREE? 22 A. NO NO I WAS NOT, NO. 23 Q. OKAY LET ME MAKE SURE I GOT MY QUESTION OUT? 24 A. OKAY. 25 Q. YOU WERE NOT THE WHISTLEBLOWER WITH RESPECT TO 319 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 THE PALM TREE INVESTIGATION NOTICE HORTICULTURE 2 DEPARTMENT CORRECT? 3 A. NOTIFIES THE WHISTLEBLOWER YOU ARE CORRECT. 4 Q. OKAY. IS THIS A TRUE STATEMENT: IN 2001 AN 5 OPERATIONAL REVIEW AUDIT OF THE HORTICULTURE DEPARTMENT 6 WAS CONDUCTED AND THE REPORT RECOMMENDED A SERIES OF 7 IMPROVEMENTS FOR ACCOUNT ABILITY OF CASH HANDLING 8 INCLUDING HAVING THE CASH REGISTER SYSTEM? 9 A. THAT IS CORRECT. 10 Q. AND IS THIS SENTENCE ALSO CORRECT THIS REVIEW 11 WAS FOLLOWED BY A SERIES OF MEETINGS AND E-MAILS WHERE 12 NEW PROCEDURES AND SYSTEMS WERE TO BE IMPLEMENTED BY THE 13 OFFICE OF INSTRUCTION IN THE BUSINESS OFFICE? 14 A. YES, THAT IS CORRECT. 15 Q. IN THE PECKING ORDER -- WELL LET'S -- IN THE 16 HIERARCHY OF ADMINISTRATORS AT MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY 17 COLLEGE IN 2004 WHEN YOU ARRIVED WHO WAS NO. 2? 18 A. WELL THERE ISN'T SUCH A THING AS A NO. 2 IN 19 THAT THE THREE VICE PRESIDENTS ARE NO. 2 IN ESSENCE. 20 AND IN TERMS OF SENIORITY VICE PRESIDENT HATOFF WAS THE 21 MOST SENIOR THEN MR. ROBERTSON -- DR. ROBERTSON, RICHARD 22 OR DICK ROBERTSON, AND THEN THE LAST ONE WOULD BE DR. ED 23 COAT WHEN I ARRIVED. 24 Q. OKAY. AND DR. COAT'S TITLE WAS VICE PRESIDENT 25 OF WHAT? 320 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. BUSINESS SERVICES. 2 Q. AND JULIE HATOFF WAS? 3 A. INSTRUCTIONAL SERVICE. 4 Q. AND -- 5 A. IT WAS DIFFERENT THE THREE DIVISIONS AND I 6 DON'T KNOW THE EXACT NAMES. I MEAN I SHOULD REMEMBER 7 THEM BUT I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY. 8 Q. OKAY? 9 A. SO BUSINESS SERVICES, INSTRUCTIONAL SERVICE 10 AND STUDENT AS MUCH ASS. 11 Q. AND WHO WAS STUDENT SERVICINGS? 12 A. MR. DICK ROBERTSON DR. DICK ROBERTSON. 13 Q. OKAY LAST FRIDAY I ASKED YOU VERY QUICKLY 14 WHETHER MS. HATOFF WAS POPULAR AT THE SCHOOL. AND 15 YOU -- MY RECOLLECTION WAS YOU SAID NO. AND I WANTED TO 16 ASK YOU WHY YOU SAID THAT. 17 MR. WINET: LET ME OBJECT. THE QUESTION YOU 18 ASKED LAST TIME I BELIEVE WAS, WAS SHE A POPULAR FACULTY 19 MEMBER I BELIEVE IS WHAT YOU HAD -- OR WORDS TO THAT 20 EFFECT. AND SHE WASN'T A FACULTY MEMBER. 21 MR. COZAD: OKAY. 22 MR. WINET: SO THE QUESTION THAT YOU ASKED 23 WAS, WAS A DIFFERENT QUESTION THAN WHAT YOU'RE SAYING 24 RIGHT NOW. 25 321 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. SO YOU ANSWERED BASED ON SHE'S NOT A FACULTY 3 MEMBER THEREFORE? 4 A. CORRECT. 5 Q. THE ANSWER IS? 6 A. NO CORRECT. 7 Q. OKAY. WELL LET ME ASK YOU AGAIN. WAS SHE A 8 POPULAR ADMINISTRATOR? 9 A. THERE WERE A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO REALLY LIKED 10 HER. THERE WERE PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T LIKE HER. THERE WERE 11 PEOPLE WHO WERE AFRAID OF HER. IT'S -- WHAT HAPPENS 12 WITH MOST ADMINISTRATORS JUST ABOUT ANYWHERE YOU GO. 13 SOME PEOPLE LOVE YOU. SOME PEOPLE DON'T LOVE YOU AND 14 SOME PEOPLE ARE AFRAID OF YOU. 15 Q. ON BALANCE HAS SHE BEEN REPORTED IN THE PRESS, 16 FOR EXAMPLE, AS HAVING BEEN A VERY POPULAR ADMINISTRATOR 17 WITHIN THE SCHOOL? 18 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION TO SOME 19 EXTENT CALLS FOR SPECULATION AS TO WHAT'S REPORTED TO IN 20 THE PRESS. BUT YOU CAN GO AHEAD AND ANSWER. 21 A. I HAVE READ THE ARTICLES EVER SINCE HER -- 22 WHEN SHE WAS PLACED ON ADMINISTRATIVE LEAVE AND THE 23 ARTICLES HAVE QUOTED HER AS BEING A POPULAR 24 ADMINISTRATOR, YES. 25 322 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. AND DID YOU FIND THAT TO BE THE CASE ALSO 3 WITHIN THE MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY COLLEGE FACULTY 4 COMMUNITY? 5 MR. WINET: YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT MS. HATOFF? 6 MR. COZAD: CORRECT. 7 A. NOT 100 PERCENT. SOME PEOPLE THOUGHT SHE WAS 8 REALLY -- WAS VERY POPULAR AND OTHER PEOPLE DID NOT LIKE 9 HER STYLE. 10 BY MR. COZAD: 11 Q. BY AND LARGE MORE THAN HUNDRED -- MORE THAN 12 HALF DID YOU FIND SEEMED TO LIKE? 13 A. SHE WAS YEAH SHE WAS LIKED SHE HAD BEEN THERE 14 FOR OVER 35 YEARS SO ... 15 Q. OKAY. NOW DID YOU HAVE ANY DISAGREEMENTS WITH 16 MS. HATOFF THAT GO BEYOND WHAT YOU WOULD CONSIDER, YOU 17 KNOW, LET'S SAY A FRIENDLY DISAGREEMENT OVER POLICY? 18 A. NO. 19 Q. DID YOU EVER HAVE ANY EXCHANGES WITH HER IN 20 WHICH VOICES WERE RAISED? 21 A. YES. 22 Q. WHEN WAS -- HOW MANY TIMES HAD THAT HAPPENED 23 TO YOUR BEST RECOLLECTION? 24 A. TWICE. 25 Q. AND WHAT WAS THE MOST SIGNIFICANT EVENT THAT 323 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 CAUSED YOU TO HAVE WHAT I'LL CALL A HEATED EXCHANGES 2 WITH MS. HATOFF? 3 MR. WINET: COUNSEL I COULD ASK FOR AN OFFER 4 OF PROOF I DON'T SEE HOW THIS ADDRESSES THE ISSUES THAT 5 THE COURT -- WE'RE NOW NOT GOING INTO THIS WITNESS THE 6 CLAIMS INVOLVING THIS WITNESS BUT WE'RE ADDRESSING MS. 7 HATOFF'S CLAIMS AND I DON'T SEE HOW THAT IS -- COMPORTS 8 WITH THE COURT'S ORDER IN THIS CASE AND IF I COULD HAVE 9 AN OFFER OF PROOF OTHERWISE I'M GOING TO SAY IT'S NOT 10 REASONABLY CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF 11 ADMISSIBLE EVIDENCE AND OUTSIDE THIS COURT'S ORDER. 12 MR. COZAD: WELL LET ME JUST ASK YOU A QUICK 13 QUESTION. 14 BY MR. COZAD: 15 Q. DID YOUR HANDLING OF THE PLACEMENT OF MS. 16 HATOFF ON ADMINISTRATIVE LEAVE LEAD TO SOME OF THE 17 CRITICISM THAT BY THE MINORITY TRUSTEES THAT WE'VE 18 TALKED ABOUT IN CONNECTION WITH THIS CASE? 19 A. I DO NOT THINK SO NO, NOT MY HANDLING OF IT, 20 NO, HUH-UH. 21 Q. OKAY. 22 A. CAN WE TAKE A QUICK BREAK? 23 MR. WINET: SURE. 24 MR. COZAD: ALL RIGHT. 25 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: ALL RIGHT GOING OFF THE 324 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 RECORD AT 356. 2 (RECESS). 3 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: WE'RE BACK ON THE RECORD. 4 IT'S 358. 5 MR. WINET: WE'RE BACK ON THE RECORD. I SPOKE 6 WITH THE WITNESS OFF THE RECORD WITHOUT DISCLOSING ANY 7 ATTORNEY-CLIENT INFORMATION THERE'S A CONCERN AS TO 8 ABOUT WHERE THE TRANSCRIPT WAS LEFT OFF AND THE 9 INSINUATION AS FAR AS THE RAISED VOICES WITH MS. HATOFF 10 AND THE INFERENCE THAT IT WAS RAISED VOICES WITH 11 DR. RICHART AND IT ACTUALLY INVOLVED CIRCUMSTANCES 12 INVOLVING OTHER SITUATIONS AND OTHER PEOPLE. AND SO SHE 13 WANTED TO CLARIFY THAT FOR THE RECORD. IF YOU WANT TO 14 ASK HER ABOUT IT, FINE. IF YOU DON'T, THAT'S FINE. 15 A. I JUST -- THE INFERENCE FROM THE RECORD I 16 DIDN'T WANT TO LEAVE THE INFERENCE ON THE RECORD BEING 17 THAT MS. HATOFF AND DR. RICHART HAD BEEN -- RAISED THEIR 18 VOICES AS TO EACH OTHER. 19 MR. COZAD: OKAY. 20 MR. WINET: OKAY. 21 MR. COZAD: THANK YOU. 22 MR. WINET: UH-HUH. 23 BY MR. COZAD: 24 Q. ALL RIGHT LET'S MAKE -- LET'S CLEAR THAT UP. 25 HAD THERE BEEN AN OCCASION IN WHICH YOU AND IS IT 325 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 DR. HATOFF? 2 A. NO. 3 Q. MS. HATOFF HAD A HEATED CONVERSATION IN WHICH 4 VOICES WERE RAISED? 5 A. BETWEEN MS. HATOFF AND MYSELF? 6 Q. CORRECT. 7 A. NO. 8 Q. AND SAME QUESTION BUT WERE YOU EVER IN A GROUP 9 OF PEOPLE IN WHICH YOU AND MS. HATOFF WERE PRESENT AND 10 THERE WAS A HEATED DISCUSSION ABOUT MS. HATOFF? 11 A. I WAS PRESENT IN A MEETING WITH THE THREE VICE 12 PRESIDENTS WHERE VICE PRESIDENT HATOFF RAISED HER VOICE 13 AND WAS VERY AGITATED AT THE TWO VICE PRESIDENTS. AND I 14 ASKED HER TO PLEASE LOWER HER VOICE AND RESPECT THE 15 OTHER TWO VICE PRESIDENTS. AND THAT'S ONE OF THE 16 SITUATIONS THAT OCCURRED. 17 Q. WHAT WAS THE DISCUSSION ABOUT IN WHICH THAT -- 18 A. IT WAS ABOUT THE PROPOSAL BY VICE PRESIDENT 19 ROBERTSON TO MAKE A CHANGE AT THE SUNDAY ELIJO CAMPUS 20 REGARDING THE ORGANIZATIONAL STRUCTURE WITHIN THE 21 STUDENT SERVICINGS DIVISION. HE HAD PROPOSED THAT TO 22 ME. HE HAD DISCUSSED IT WITH VICE PRESIDENT COAT. I 23 HAD AUTHORIZED THE CHANGE GIVEN THAT IT HAPPENED IN HIS 24 DIVISION. AND VICE PRESIDENT HATOFF WAS VERY ANGRY THAT 25 SHE HAD NOT BEEN ASKED HER OPINION. 326 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. OKAY. WHAT OTHER HEATED EXCHANGES WERE THERE 2 IN YOUR PRECEDENCE -- PRESENCE IN WHICH MS. HATOFF WAS 3 INVOLVED? 4 A. THE SECOND OCCASION WAS WHEN MR. ROBERT PRICE 5 AND OUR LEGAL -- MIRACOSTA COLLEGE'S LEGAL COUNSEL DAN 6 SHINOFF PRESENTED TO MS. HATOFF THE FINDINGS OF THEIR 7 INVESTIGATION. SHE BECAME VERY AGITATED AND VERY ANGRY 8 AT THAT MEETING. 9 Q. WHAT WAS IT THAT TRIGGERED THE AGITATION THAT 10 YOU WITNESSED? 11 A. SHE -- 12 MR. WINET: WAS THIS IN CLOSED SESSION MEETING 13 OR OPEN SESSION. 14 A. NO IT WAS -- 15 MR. SLEETH: BOARD. 16 MR. WINET: OKAY. 17 A. IT WAS, IT WAS THE PRESENTATION OF THE 18 FINDINGS OF MR. PRICE'S INVESTIGATION AND VICE 19 PRESIDENTS HATOFF INVOLVEMENT WITHIN THAT CONTEXT. 20 BY MR. COZAD: 21 Q. AND WHAT WAS IT ABOUT THE FINDINGS INVOLVING 22 MS. HATOFF'S INVOLVEMENT THAT TRIGGERED THE HEATED 23 DISCUSSION? 24 MR. WINET: I DON'T THINK SHE CAN ANSWER THAT 25 WITHOUT A WAIVER FROM MS. HATOFF. 327 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MR. SLEETH: WELL THAT'S ANOTHER PLACE WHERE A 2 LOT OF IT IS IN THAT LAWSUIT BUT IT'S ALSO NOT 3 CALCULATED TO LEAD TO RELEVANT EVIDENCE WE'RE NOW IN THE 4 MIDDLE OF HATOFF'S LAWSUIT. 5 MR. WINET: YEAH. 6 MR. SLEETH: AND WHETHER OR NOT SHE KNEW ABOUT 7 THE PALM TREES AND FAILED TO ACT. 8 MR. WINET: THAT'S WHY I'M SAYING. WE CAN'T 9 GO DOWN THAT ROAD WITHOUT PERMISSION BY MS. HATOFF 10 AND/OR HER ATTORNEY. (MARK). 11 BY MR. COZAD: 12 Q. PRIOR TO THE PALM TREE INVESTIGATION THAT YOU 13 INITIATED HAD MS. HATOFF EVER BEEN SUBJECT TO ANY TYPE 14 OF DISCIPLINARY PROCEEDINGS? 15 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION LACKS 16 FOUNDATION AS TO YOU INITIATED. YOU CAN ANSWER. 17 A. WELL, I THINK I HAVE ALREADY LET YOU KNOW HOW 18 THE DECISION TO INITIATE THE INVESTIGATION ON THE 19 WHISTLEBLOWER TOOK PLACE. IN REGARDS TO MS. HATOFF, 20 ANYTHING THAT HAS TO DO WITH HER PERSONNEL RECORDS 21 ARE -- IS HER PRIVACY RIGHTS AND I CANNOT ADDRESS ANY OF 22 THAT. 23 BY MR. COZAD: 24 Q. DID MS. HATOFF SUE YOU FOR DAMAGES ARISING 25 FROM THE PLACEMENT OF HER ON ADMINISTRATIVE LEAVE? 328 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MR. WINET: LET ME OBJECT TO THE QUESTION 2 BECAUSE OF THE LATTER PART, THE REASON BEING PLACED ON 3 ADMINISTRATIVE LEAVE. SHE SUED HER. 4 BY MR. COZAD: 5 Q. SHE SUED YOU, RIGHT? 6 A. SHE DID. 7 Q. AND IT HAD TO DO WITH THE PALM TREE 8 INVESTIGATION, DIDN'T IT? 9 A. HER LAWSUIT SPEAKS FOR ITSELF. AND I DON'T 10 RECALL THE DETAILS. 11 Q. IT DIDN'T HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH THE PALM 12 TREE INVESTIGATION? 13 A. IT HAD TO DO WITH A LOT OF THINGS, THAT'S WHAT 14 I'M SAYING IT'S JUST -- THERE WAS A LOT OF ASSERTIONS IN 15 HER LAWSUIT. 16 Q. OKAY. 17 A. HER LAWSUIT HAS BEEN DISMISSED THOUGH, RIGHT? 18 MR. SLEETH: YES. 19 MR. WINET: YES. 20 A. WITH PREJUDICE? 21 MR. WINET: YES. FOR PURPOSES OF THE RECORD 22 WE BROUGHT AN ANTI-SLAPP MOTION. IT'S PUBLIC RECORD IN 23 RESPONSE TO MS. HATOFF'S FILING OF SUIT AND THEN HER 24 ATTORNEY AGREED TO DISMISS THE CASE WITH PREJUDICE 25 AGAINST DR. RICHART. 329 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MR. SLEETH: THE REMAINDER OF THE LAWSUIT IS 2 ALSO AGAINST THE DISTRICT. 3 MR. COZAD: OKAY. 4 BY MR. COZAD: 5 Q. WERE YOU AWARE THAT YOUR ATTORNEY FILED A 6 SLAPP, ANTI-SLAPP MOTION AGAINST MS. HATOFF? 7 A. I WAS AWARE THAT MR. WINET FILED AN ANTI-SLAPP 8 MOTION AGAINST MS. HATOFF, YES. 9 Q. OKAY. AND WAS A SIMILAR MOTION FILED IN THE 10 KRASKOUSKAS CASE? 11 A. A SIMILAR MOTION WAS FILED AGAINST MS. 12 KRASKOUSKAS. 13 Q. THANK YOU. WHAT IS THE -- WHAT IS YOUR 14 UNDERSTANDING OF THE -- HOW AN ANTI-SLAPP MOTION WORKS? 15 MR. WINET: OBJECTION CALLS FOR IMPROPER LEGAL 16 CONCLUSION LACKS FOUNDATION AS TO THIS WITNESS. 17 MR. SLEETH: AND I'M AT A COMPLETE LOSS OF HOW 18 THIS WOULD BE EVEN REMOTELY RELEVANT TO THE SCOPE OF THE 19 INQUIRY THE JUDGE HAS PERMITTED. HER OPINION ABOUT HOW 20 A SLAPP SUIT WORKS WHEN WE PREVAILED CAN'T POSSIBLY 21 IMPACT HER LAWSUIT HERE. 22 BY MR. COZAD: 23 Q. DO YOU HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING OF THE ISSUES 24 INVOLVED IN AN ANTI-SLAPP MOTION? 25 A. I HAVE A GENERAL UNDERSTANDING. 330 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. WHAT IS THAT GENERAL UNDERSTANDING, PLEASE? 2 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION, CALLS FOR IMPROPER 3 LEGAL OPINION AND CONCLUSION, LACKS FOUNDATION AS TO 4 THIS WITNESS. YOU CAN ANSWER. 5 A. IN GENERAL TERMS IT'S THAT I ACTED WITHIN THE 6 SCOPE OF MY RESPONSIBILITIES. 7 BY MR. COZAD: 8 Q. AND DO YOU HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING AS TO WHETHER 9 A DETERMINATION IS MADE THAT CERTAIN COMMUNICATIONS ARE 10 PROTECTED BY A PERSON'S FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHTS? 11 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION CALLS FOR 12 LEGAL OPINION, LACKS FOUNDATION AS TO THIS WITNESS. 13 MR. SLEETH: MISSTATES THE LEGAL STANDARD. 14 MR. WINET: YOU CAN ANSWER, IF YOU CAN. 15 A. I JUST DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN. I WOULD BE 16 HAPPY TO ANSWER BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN. 17 BY MR. COZAD: 18 Q. SURE. APPROXIMATELY WHEN WAS IT THAT YOU HAD 19 AN ANTI-SLAPP MOTION FILED ON YOUR BEHALF IN THE 20 *KRAKOUSUS CASE? 21 MR. WINET: OBJECTION QUESTION LACKS 22 FOUNDATION AS TO THIS WITNESS YOU CAN ANSWER DID YOU 23 KNOW. 24 A. I DON'T RECALL. 25 331 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. WAS IT BEFORE OR AFTER YOUR SETTLEMENT WITH 3 MIRACOSTA? 4 A. I DON'T RECALL. 5 Q. ARE YOU FAMILIAR WITH A CASE INVOLVING A 6 PRESIDENT OR AN ADMINISTRATOR IN LOS ANGELES NAMED 7 MORROW? 8 A. NAMED? 9 Q. MORROW. M-O-R-R-O-W. 10 A. NO, I DON'T THINK SO. 11 MR. COZAD: LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE'LL MARK AS 12 EXHIBIT 52. 13 (EXHIBIT 52 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 14 A. THIS IS YOURS RIGHTS. 15 MR. WINET: THAT'S MINE. 16 A. OKAY. 17 BY MR. COZAD: 18 Q. WHAT'S YOUR GENERAL UNDERSTANDING OF THE 19 ISSUES INVOLVED IN THE KRASKOUSKAS CASE, WHAT WAS THAT 20 ABOUT? 21 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION IS NOT 22 REASONABLY CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF 23 ADMISSIBLE EVIDENCE IN THIS CASE. LACKS FOUNDATION. 24 YOU CAN ANSWER THE QUESTION. 25 A. SHE MADE SEVERAL ACCUSATIONS THAT WERE, IN MY 332 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 OPINION, UNFOUNDED. I DON'T RECALL. I MEAN IT'S -- THE 2 DETAILS TO BE HONEST WITH YOU. I READ IT ONCE AND 3 DIDN'T FIND IT TO BE VERY CREDIBLE. 4 BY MR. COZAD: 5 Q. DID YOU -- HAVE YOU EVER READ EXHIBIT 52 6 BEFORE TODAY? 7 A. YES IT LOOKS LIKE IT. I HAVE. 8 Q. MAY I SEE IT, PLEASE. 9 A. SURE. 10 Q. THANK YOU. SHOWING YOU PAGE 6 OF EXHIBIT 52. 11 BEGINNING AT LINE 8. IF YOU WOULD TAKE A LOOK AT THAT 12 PARAGRAPH. 13 A. PAGE -- SO LINE 8? 14 Q. RIGHT. 15 A. UH-HUH. 16 Q. THERE'S A REFERENCE TO A CASE INVOLVING A 17 PLAINTIFF NAMED MORROW. 18 A. UH-HUH. 19 Q. DID YOU REVIEW THE MORROW CASE? 20 A. DID I. 21 Q. AT ANYTIME AROUND WHEN THIS ANTI-SLAPP MOTION 22 WAS FILED? 23 A. THAT I REVIEWED PERSONALLY. 24 Q. YES? 25 A. NO, I DID NOT REVIEW IT PERSONALLY. 333 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. DID YOU DISCUSS THE MORROW CASE WITH ANYONE 2 ABOUT THE TIME THIS ANTI-SLAPP MOTION WAS FILED? 3 A. DID I DISCUSS WITH PEOPLE IN GENERAL? 4 Q. YES. 5 A. THE MORROW CASE? 6 Q. YES, MA'AM. 7 A. NO. 8 Q. OKAY. DID YOU AUTHORIZE THIS BRIEF TO BE 9 FILED ON YOUR BEHALF? 10 MR. WINET: OBJECTION ATTORNEY-CLIENT 11 PRIVILEGE. I'LL INSTRUCT YOU NOT TO ANSWER. (MARK). 12 BY MR. COZAD: 13 Q. CAN I TAKE A LOOK, PLEASE? THANK YOU. DID 14 YOU EVER HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH ANYONE IN WHICH IT WAS 15 STATED THAT THE MORROW CASE IS REMARKABLY SIMILAR TO THE 16 KRASKOUSUS CASE? 17 MR. WINET: LET ME OBJECT. YOU CAN ASK -- 18 ANSWER THAT QUESTION OUTSIDE OF ANY CONVERSATIONS THAT 19 YOU HAD WITH MR. OTTILIE OR MYSELF. SO OUTSIDE THOSE 20 CONVERSATIONS YOU CAN ANSWER. 21 A. I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT THE MORROW CASE IS. I 22 MEAN I HAVE A GENERAL -- I TRUST MY ATTORNEYS TO QUOTE 23 THE CORRECT CASES THAT MAKE -- THAT BRING A POINT OF 24 LAW. I'M NOT THE EXPERT. 25 334 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. DID YOU HAVE ANY CONCERN -- STRIKE THAT. 3 AS OF APPROXIMATELY APRIL 2007 DID YOU BELIEVE 4 YOU HAD A MERITORIOUS DEFENSE AGAINST THE KRASKOUSUS -- 5 WELL I'M GOING TO RESTATE THE QUESTION. 6 IN APPROXIMATELY APRIL OF 2007 DID YOU BELIEVE 7 THAT YOU HAD A MERITORIOUS DEFENSE IN THE KRASKOUSUS 8 CASE BASED ON THE ANTI-SLAPP MOTION THAT YOUR ATTORNEY 9 FILED ON YOUR BEHALF? 10 MR. WINET: OBJECTION CALLS FOR LEGAL 11 CONCLUSION, LACKS FOUNDATION AS TO THIS WITNESS. ANSWER 12 IF YOU HAD A YOUR OWN OPINION. 13 A. I DON'T KNOW WHAT MERITORIOUS MEANS LEGALLY. 14 BUT WHAT I DID KNOW IS THAT MS. KRASKOUSUS CLAIMS WERE 15 UNFOUNDED. AND SO REGARDLESS OF IN WHICH MANNER THE 16 LAWSUIT WAS GOING TO BE RESOLVED, I KNEW FOR CERTAIN 17 THAT THE COLLEGE NEITHER MIRACOSTA NOR I HAD DONE 18 ANYTHING INAPPROPRIATE. AND WE WOULD PREVAIL AND NO 19 MATTER WHAT NO MATTER HOW THAT LAWSUIT WAS RESOLVED. 20 BY MR. COZAD: 21 Q. NOW MS. KRASKOUSUS ALLEGED FOUR CAUSES OF 22 ACTION AGAINST YOU INCLUDING INTENTIONAL INFLICTION OF 23 EMOTIONAL DISTRESS, VIOLATION OF RIGHTS TO PRIVACY, IN 24 INTENTIONAL INTERFERENCE WITH CONTRACT AND DEFORMATION 25 SLANDER; IS THAT CORRECT? 335 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. I DON'T KNOW. I DON'T HAVE IT IN FRONT OF ME. 2 AND I DON'T RECALL. 3 Q. OKAY. LET ME READ FOR YOU BEGINNING ON PAGE 2 4 OF EXHIBIT 52 IN WHICH IT'S WRITTEN "ON JANUARY 18, 2007 5 PLAINTIFF EILEEN KRASKOUSUS SUED THE COLLEGE AND 6 PRESIDENT RICHART IN THE VISTA SUPERIOR COURT. SHE 7 ASSERTED FOUR CAUSES OF ACTION AGAINST PRESIDENT 8 RICHART, INCLUDING INTENTIONAL INFLICTION OF EMOTIONAL 9 DISTRESS, VIOLATION OF HER CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHT TO 10 PRIVACY, INTENTIONAL INTERFERENCE WITH CONTRACT AND 11 DEFORMATION SLANDER." 12 NOW; IS THAT CORRECT? 13 A. IT'S CORRECT THAT YOU'RE READING FROM THE 14 LEGAL BRIEF THAT MR. WINET PREPARED. 15 MR. WINET: I'LL OBJECT THE WORDS YOU'RE 16 READING ARE MY WORDS NOT HERS. 17 BY MR. COZAD: 18 Q. NOW THE LETTER THAT MR. OTTILIE WROTE ON YOUR 19 BEHALF IN AUGUST OF 2007 SETS FORTH POTENTIAL CLAIMS ON 20 YOUR BEHALF OF INTENTIONAL INFLICTION OF EMOTIONAL 21 DISTRESS, TRUE? 22 A. I DON'T HAVE THE LETTER IN FRONT OF ME. I 23 MEAN I COULD LOOK FOR IT. DO YOU WANT ME TO READ FOR 24 THOSE WORDS FROM MR. OTTILIE? 25 Q. NO. DO YOU HAVE AN UNDERSTANDING THAT HE WAS 336 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 ARGUING ON YOUR BEHALF THAT YOU HAD SUFFERED FROM 2 INTENTIONAL INFLICTION OF EMOTIONAL DISTRESS? 3 A. I DON'T WANT TO SAY ANYTHING THAT I CANNOT 4 READ FOR MYSELF. SO I CAN TAKE A LOOK. I HAVE THE 5 LETTER IN FRONT OF ME. 6 Q. DO YOU HAVE IT THERE? 7 A. YES. 8 Q. DO YOU WANT TO LOOK THROUGH THAT? 9 A. IT'S EXHIBIT 51. 10 Q. ALL RIGHT. 11 A. SO CAN YOU POINT ME TO WHERE HE SAYS THAT? 12 MR. WINET: IT'S PAGE 14. THIRD PARAGRAPH 13 UNDER LIABILITY ISSUES. WHERE IT STARTS THE PARAGRAPH 14 WHILE NOT. 15 A. OKAY. 16 BY MR. COZAD: 17 Q. DO YOU SEE THAT MR. OTTILIE SAYS -- 18 A. I DO SEE IT, YES. 19 Q. THAT YOU SUFFERED INTENTIONAL AND NEGLIGENT 20 INFLICTION OF EMOTIONAL DISTRESS, RIGHT? 21 A. NO, NO, IT DOESN'T SAY THAT I SUFFERED THAT. 22 Q. OKAY. 23 A. IT SAYS WHILE NOT REQUIRED HERE TO IDENTIFY 24 ALL OF THE THEORIES UPON WHICH DR. RICHART WOULD PROCEED 25 THOSE THEORIES COULD HAVE INCLUDED AND WILL BE -- WILL 337 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 IF NECESSARY CLAIMS -- AND THEN HE MAKES A LIST, AMONGST 2 THE LIST IS INFLICTION OF EMOTIONAL DISTRESS. 3 Q. OKAY DO YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU SUFFERED 4 INTENTION WILLING AND NEGLIGENT INFLICTION OF EMOTIONAL 5 DISTRESS? 6 MR. SLEETH: CALLS FOR LEGAL CONCLUSION. 7 MR. WINET: YEAH THE WAY THE QUESTION IS ASKED 8 IT CALLS PURELY FOR A LEGAL CONCLUSION AND I'LL INSTRUCT 9 THE WITNESS NOT TO ANSWER. (MARK). 10 BY MR. COZAD: 11 Q. THAT IS THE SAME TYPE OF CLAIM THAT MS. 12 KRASKOUSUS MADE IN THE LAWSUIT AGAINST YOU WHICH WAS 13 ADDRESSED IN THE MOTION -- 14 MR. SLEETH: THIS IS JUST NOT FAIR AT ALL. 15 YOU KNOW THAT CASES ARE BASED ON FACTS, NOT ON THE NAME 16 OF THE CAUSE OF ACTION AND DIFFERENT FACTS WILL RAISE A 17 DIFFERENT CAUSE OF ACTION YOU KNOW WELL. 18 MR. COZAD: DO YOU HAVE A LEGAL OBJECTION. 19 MR. SLEETH: I DO HAVE A LEGAL OBJECTION. 20 MR. COZAD: PLEASE STATE THE LEGAL OBJECTION. 21 MR. SLEETH: YOU'RE BADGERING THE WITNESS. 22 MR. COZAD: OKAY. 23 MR. SLEETH: YOU'RE BADGERING THE WITNESS BY 24 TRYING. 25 MR. COZAD: PLEASE STATE THE LEGAL OBJECTION 338 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 AND STOP COACHING THE WITNESS AND STOP INTERRUPTING ME, 2 PLEASE. 3 MR. SLEETH: YOU'RE CONDUCT IS IMPROPER AND 4 SHAMEFUL IF A LAWYER IS MY LEGAL OBJECTION. YOUR 5 CONDUCT HERE IS IGNORING FACTS AND PUTTING OUT LAWSUIT 6 CAUSES OF ACTION AS IF THEY WERE IDENTICAL AND THEY ARE 7 NOT BECAUSE DIFFERENT FACTS RAISE DIFFERENT CLAIMS. 8 IT'S NOT FAIR. 9 MR. COZAD: ARE YOU DONE? 10 MR. SLEETH: I'M NOT ANYWHERE NEAR DONE. BUT 11 WE'LL SEE IT GO AS IT GOES ON. THIS IS A SHAMEFUL SPECK 12 AT THAT CAL FOR ANYBODY TO HAVE TO PUT UP WITH. 13 MR. COZAD: SAY WHAT YOU WANT TO SAY I DON'T 14 WANT TO HAVE TO LISTEN TO THIS EVERY QUESTION. 15 MR. SLEETH: YOU MAY HAVE TO. 16 MR. COZAD: ALL RIGHT. WELL -- 17 BY MR. COZAD: 18 Q. NOW MS. KRASKOUSUS MADE A CLAIM THAT HER 19 RIGHTS TO PRIVACY WERE VIOLATED, TRUE? 20 A. SHE MADE A CLAIM. 21 Q. AND YOU MADE A CLAIM THAT YOUR RIGHTS TO 22 PRIVACY WERE VIOLATED, TRUE? 23 A. I MADE A CLAIM. 24 Q. AND MS. KRASKOUSUS MADE A CLAIM THAT HER 25 CONTRACT RIGHTS WERE VIOLATED, TRUE? 339 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. I GUESS SHE MADE A CLAIM. YOU'RE READING FROM 2 IT. I DON'T HAVE IT IN FRONT OF ME. 3 Q. OKAY. AND YOU MADE A CLAIM THAT YOUR CONTRACT 4 RIGHTS WERE VIOLATED AS WELL, CORRECT? 5 A. I DON'T THINK I MADE A CLAIM THAT MY CONTRACT 6 RIGHTS WERE VIOLATED. 7 Q. DID YOU STATE PUBLICLY THAT YOUR CONTRACT IS 8 VERY CLEAR AND THAT IT DOES NOT ALLOW PUBLIC AIRING OF 9 EMPLOYEE PERFORMANCE REVIEWS? 10 MR. SLEETH: ASSUMES FACTS NOT IN EVIDENCE. 11 MR. WINET: TO SOME EXTENT THE WAY IT'S STATED 12 MISSTATES WHAT SHE SAID. 13 MR. SLEETH: SHE SAID HER RIGHTS HAD BEEN 14 VIOLATED NOT HER CONTRACT RIGHTS HAD BEEN VIOLATED. 15 MR. WINET: DO YOU HAVE THE QUESTION IN MIND 16 OR NOT? 17 A. I DO BUT I DIDN'T SAY THAT. WE -- IN MY 18 PREVIOUS DEPOSITION I STATED -- WE READ THE LETTER AND 19 WHAT I SAID IN THE LETTER, WHICH WAS THAT THE PROVISIONS 20 FOR MY EVALUATION ARE CLEAR IN MY CONTRACT. 21 BY MR. COZAD: 22 Q. OKAY. MS. KRASKOUSUS MADE A -- KRASKOUSUS 23 ALSO CLAIMED THAT SHE WAS A VICTIM OF DEFORMATION AND 24 SLANDER, RIGHT? 25 MR. WINET: YOU SAY ALSO. THAT QUESTION IS 340 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 AMBIGUOUS AND VAGUE. ALSO IT'S NOT REASONABLY 2 CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF ADMISSIBLE 3 EVIDENCE IN THIS CASE. TO THE EXTENT THAT YOU KNOW THE 4 ANSWER TO THE QUESTION GO AHEAD AND ANSWER IT. 5 A. I DON'T KNOW IN RELATION TO ALSO -- IN 6 RELATION TO WHAT. 7 BY MR. COZAD: 8 Q. DID MS. KRASKOUSUS SUE YOU FOR DEFORMATION AND 9 SLANDER AMONG OTHER THINGS? 10 MR. WINET: THE QUESTION IS WHETHER SHE SUED 11 YOU FOR THOSE THINGS. 12 A. I THINK SO. 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. OKAY. AND THE CLAIM THAT MR. OTTILIE 15 DESCRIBED ON YOUR BEHALF ON AUGUST 15, 2007, ALSO 16 INCLUDED ALLEGED DEFORMATION AND SLANDER BY THE MINORITY 17 TRUSTEES AGAINST YOU, CORRECT? 18 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION LACKS 19 FOUNDATION AS TO THE USE OF THE TERM SLANDER. 20 A. YEAH I DON'T KNOW THE LEGAL REQUIREMENTS IN 21 TERMS OF PROVING SLANDER BUT MR. OTTILIE DID WRITE ABOUT 22 THAT, YES. 23 BY MR. COZAD: 24 Q. WHEN MR. WINET FILED THIS BRIEF ON YOUR BEHALF 25 IN APRIL OF 2007, YOU BELIEVED THIS -- YOU WOULD PREVAIL 341 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 ON THIS MOTION AND HAVE THE MATTER DISMISSED AGAINST 2 YOU, DIDN'T YOU? 3 MR. WINET: OBJECTION CALLS FOR SPECULATION 4 LACK OF FOUNDATION THAT SHE HAD ANY OPINION AFTER 5 READING THAT WHETHER SHE WOULD PREVAIL. YOU CAN ANSWER. 6 A. I'VE ALREADY ANSWERED THAT QUESTION BEFORE 7 THAT REGARDLESS UNDER WHICH PROCESS HER LAWSUIT WAS 8 GOING TO BE ADDRESSED, I KNEW FOR A FACT THAT THERE WAS 9 NO FOUNDATION ON HER CLAIMS AND THEREFORE THE COLLEGE 10 AND I WOULD PREVAIL. 11 BY MR. COZAD: 12 Q. SIMILARLY, YOU KNEW IN APRIL OF 2007 THAT 13 THERE WAS NO FOUNDATION FOR THE CLAIMS THAT WOULD 14 ULTIMATELY BE MADE BY MR. OTTILIE ON YOUR BEHALF, ISN'T 15 THAT TRUE? 16 MR. WINET: OBJECTION ARGUMENTATIVE, MISSTATES 17 EVIDENCE AND HER TESTIMONY. 18 A. YOU'RE ASKING ME IF IN APRIL OF 2007 I KNEW 19 THAT THE ARGUMENTS THAT MR. OTTILIE WAS GOING TO MAKE IN 20 AUGUST? 21 MR. COZAD: THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I'M ASKING 22 YOU. 23 A. WERE UNTRUE? 24 BY MR. COZAD: 25 Q. YOU KNEW AS FAR BACK AS APRIL OF 2007 THAT IF 342 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 YOU BROUGHT A CLAIM AGAINST THE MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY 2 COLLEGE DISTRICT FOR INTENTIONAL INFLICTION OF EMOTIONAL 3 DISTRESS, VIOLATION OF RIGHTS TO PRIVACY, INTENTIONAL 4 INTERFERENCE WITH CONTRACT AND DEFORMATION ON THE FACTS 5 THAT THEY EXISTED IN APRIL THAT YOU WOULD LOSE? 6 MR. WINET: OBJECTION. 7 BY MR. COZAD: 8 Q. ISN'T THAT TRUE? 9 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION LACKS 10 FOUNDATION, MISSTATES THE TESTIMONY, CALLS FOR IMPROPER 11 OPINION AND CONCLUSION ANSWER IF -- 12 A. I TRULY DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE ASKING 13 ME. 14 BY MR. COZAD: 15 Q. OKAY. IN APRIL OF 2007 BASED ON YOUR 16 FAMILIARITY WITH MR. WINET'S BRIEF THAT HE FILED ON YOUR 17 BEHALF IN KRASKOUSUS YOU KNEW THAT IF YOUR CASE AGAINST 18 MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY COLLEGE EVER WENT TO COURT? 19 A. UH-HUH. 20 Q. YOU WOULD LOSE ISN'T THAT TRUE? 21 A. IT IS NOT TRUE. 22 Q. AND ISN'T IT TRUE THAT YOU ATTEMPTED TO 23 RESOLVE YOUR CASE THROUGH SETTLEMENT AND MEDIATION WITH 24 JUDGE MOON SO THAT YOU CAN AVOID HAVING AN ANTI-SLAPP 25 MOTION TO STRIKE THE COMPLAINT FILED AGAINST YOU JUST 343 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 LIKE THE ONE THAT MR. WINET SUCCESSFULLY FILED AGAINST 2 MS. KRASKOUSUS? 3 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION LACKS 4 FOUNDATION. MISSTATES THE EVIDENCE. YOU CAN ANSWER. 5 A. IT IS NOT TRUE. 6 BY MR. COZAD: 7 Q. DID YOU LOBBY THE FOUR TRUSTEES THAT ARE 8 SYMPATHETIC TO YOU PRIOR TO JUNE 20TH 2007 FOR THEIR 9 SUPPORT IN A BUY OUT OF YOUR CONTRACT THAT EXCEEDED THE 10 18 MONTHS ALLOWED BY THE CALIFORNIA GOVERNMENT CODE? 11 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION IS 12 ARGUMENTATIVE. IT LACKS FOUNDATION. IT ASSUMES FACTS 13 NOT IN EVIDENCE. YOU CAN ANSWER. 14 A. NO. 15 BY MR. COZAD: 16 Q. DID YOU ASK MR. ADAMS TO CONFER WITH THE 17 MINORITY TRUSTEES IN AN EFFORT TO GAIN SUPPORT FOR A 18 BUYOUT OF YOUR CONTRACT THAT EXCEEDED THE LIMITS IMPOSED 19 BY THE CALIFORNIA GOVERNMENT CODE PRIOR TO JUNE 20TH, 20 2007? 21 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION CALLS FOR 22 IMPROPER LEGAL CONCLUSION. IT ALSO MISSTATES THE 23 EVIDENCE. YOU CAN ANSWER. 24 A. NO. 25 344 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. DID -- PRIOR TO JUNE 20TH, 2007, DID THE 3 COMMUNITY COLLEGE DISTRICT RETAIN COUNSEL TO DEFEND IT 4 AGAINST ANY POTENTIAL CLAIMS THAT YOU MAY HAVE ARISING 5 FROM THE -- YOUR EMPLOYMENT AT MIRACOSTA? 6 MR. WINET: OBJECTION MAY CALLS FOR 7 SPECULATION, MAY LACK FOUNDATION YOU CAN ANSWER WHAT YOU 8 KNOW. 9 A. CAN YOU REPEAT THE QUESTION. 10 BY MR. COZAD: 11 Q. YEAH? 12 A. THE LAST PARTS YOU CONFUSED ME. 13 Q. SURE. PRIOR TO JUNE 20TH, 2007 DID THE 14 COLLEGE DISTRICT, MIRACOSTA, RETAIN AN ATTORNEY TO 15 DEFEND IT AGAINST POTENTIAL CLAIMS THAT YOU MAY BRING 16 ARISING OUT OF YOUR EMPLOYMENT THERE? 17 A. I DON'T KNOW. 18 Q. PRIOR TO JUNE 20TH, 2007 DID MIRACOSTA DO ANY 19 INVESTIGATION INTO YOUR WORK EXPERIENCE AT CASCADIA 20 COLLEGE? 21 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, LACK OF FOUNDATION, 22 CALLS FOR SPECULATION. YOU CAN ANSWER WHAT YOU KNOW. 23 A. YES, OF COURSE THEY DID. THEY WOULDN'T HAVE 24 HIRED ME OTHERWISE. 25 345 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. WHEN WAS THE INVESTIGATION DONE? 3 A. WHEN THEY HIRED ME -- 4 Q. OKAY. 5 A. -- IN JUNE OF 2004. 6 Q. ALL RIGHT. 7 A. THEY MET WITH NUMEROUS COMMUNITY MEMBERS, 8 BOARD MEMBERS, FACULTY STAFF. THEY DID BACKGROUND 9 CHECKS. THEY -- THE ACADEMIC SENATE PRESIDENT CALLED 10 MANY OF MY PREVIOUS EMPLOYERS, MANY PEOPLE WHO HAD 11 WORKED WITH ME IN LA AS WELL AS AT CASCADIA. THERE WAS 12 A VERY THOROUGH INVESTIGATION OF MY BACKGROUND. 13 Q. WHO WAS THE ACADEMIC SENATE PRESIDENT THAT 14 YOU'RE REFERRING TO? 15 A. MR. JONATHAN COLE. 16 Q. OKAY. AND DID MR. COLE REPORT THAT HE 17 RECEIVED POSITIVE REPORTS FROM THE PEOPLE THAT HE 18 INTERVIEWED AT CASCADIA? 19 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, MAY CALLS FOR 20 SPECULATION, MAY LACK FOUNDATION AS TO THIS WITNESS. 21 YOU CAN ANSWER WHAT YOU KNOW. 22 A. I KNOW THAT I WAS TOLD THAT HE WAS IN FULL 23 SUPPORT OF MY BEING HIRED AFTER HIS INVESTIGATION. 24 BY MR. COZAD: 25 Q. OKAY. DO YOU KNOW ANY REASON WHY JONATHAN 346 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 COLE WOULD SAY ANYTHING UNTRUTHFUL ABOUT YOU? 2 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THAT'S AN IMPROPER 3 QUESTION TO A WITNESS BECAUSE IT ASKS FOR THE VERACITY 4 OF ANOTHER INDIVIDUAL WHICH IS AN IMPROPER QUESTION TO 5 ASK. TO THE EXTENT THAT YOU CAN ANSWER IT THOUGH, YOU 6 CAN SAY. 7 A. I DON'T KNOW. 8 BY MR. COZAD: 9 Q. YOU DON'T KNOW ANY REASON WHY JONATHAN COLE 10 WOULD LIE ABOUT ANYTHING WITH RESPECT TO YOU? 11 MR. WINET: SHE JUST ANSWERED THE QUESTION. 12 SHE'S NOT GOING TO ANSWER IT A SECOND TIME. 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. HAVE YOU EVER HEARD IT SUGGESTED THAT THE 15 UNION REPRESENTATIVES IN CASCADIA WERE SO ANXIOUS FOR 16 YOU TO LEAVE THAT THEY GAVE YOU A GOOD REFERENCE WHEN 17 MIRACOSTA PERFORMED THEIR BACKGROUND CHECKS? 18 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION LACKS 19 FOUNDATION, ASSUMES FACTS NOT IN EVIDENCE. THE QUESTION 20 IS IF YOU'VE EVER HEARD THAT. 21 A. NEVER. 22 BY MR. COZAD: 23 Q. SAME QUESTION WITH RESPECT TO THE LOS ANGELES 24 COMMUNITY COLLEGE DISTRICT? 25 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTIONS. GO AHEAD. 347 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. NO, NEVER. 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. IS THERE ANY REASON WHY GREG *HARBAUGH WOULD 4 LIE ABOUT YOU? 5 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION ASKS FOR AN 6 IMPROPER OPINION AND CONCLUSION AS TO SOMEONE ELSE'S 7 MONTH MOTIVATION AND VERACITY OF A PARTICULAR 8 INDIVIDUAL. TO THE EXTENT YOU CAN ANSWER GO AHEAD. 9 A. I THINK MR. HAIR BOG IS ONE OF THE THREE 10 FACULTY MEMBERS AT CASCADIA WHO WAS NOT GRANTED TENURE. 11 BY MR. COZAD: 12 Q. WHY WAS HE NOT GRANTED TENURE? 13 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THAT ISSUE MAY INVOLVE 14 HIS PRIVACY. I'LL INSTRUCT YOU NOT TO ANSWER. (MARK) 15 ALSO, IT'S NOT REASONABLY CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE 16 DISCOVERY OF ADMISSIBLE EVIDENCE IN THIS CASE. 17 BY MR. COZAD: 18 Q. WAS MR. HARBAUGH ONE OF THE ORIGINAL FACULTY 19 MEMBERS OF THE COLLEGE? 20 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION MAY LACK 21 FOUNDATION, MAY CALLS FOR SPECULATION. ANSWER WHAT YOU 22 KNOW. 23 A. HE WAS HIRED AMONGST THE FIRST GROUP OF 24 FACULTY MEMBERS, YES. 25 348 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. AND WHAT DID HE TEACH? 3 A. I DON'T REMEMBER. 4 Q. DID YOU TELL THE BOARD THAT MR. HARBAUGH WAS 5 OVERHEARD SAYING VULGAR THINGS ABOUT THE ADMINISTRATION 6 AT CASCADIA AND THAT'S WHY YOU RECOMMENDED THAT HE NOT 7 BE GRANTED TENURE? 8 MR. WINET: OBJECTION NOT REASONABLY 9 CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF ADMISSIBLE 10 EVIDENCE IN THIS CASE OUTSIDE THE COURT'S ORDER INSTRUCT 11 THE WITNESS NOT TO ANSWER. (MARK). 12 BY MR. COZAD: 13 Q. WHO IS MAUREEN RACE, R-A-C-E? 14 A. I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S HOW YOU SPELL HER LAST 15 NAME. BUT I THINK SHE'S THE OTHER -- ANOTHER FACULTY 16 MEMBERS WHO WAS NOT GRANTED TENURE BY THE CASCADIA 17 BOARD. 18 Q. DO YOU BELIEVE SHE WAS REASON TO LIE ABOUT 19 YOU? 20 MR. WINET: OBJECTION NOT REASONABLY 21 CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF DISCOVERY OF 22 ADMISSIBLE EVIDENCE OUTSIDE THE SCOPE OF THIS COURT'S 23 ORDER IN THIS CASE. I INSTRUCT THE WITNESS NOT TO 24 ANSWER. ALSO, THE OTHER OBJECTION IS CALLS FOR 25 SPECULATION AS TO ANOTHER PERSON'S MOTIVATION AS WELL AS 349 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 THE OTHER PERSON'S VERACITY. (MARK). 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. WHO IS RICHARD MORTONSON? 4 A. I THINK HE WAS ANOTHER FACULTY MEMBERS WHO WAS 5 NOT GRANTED TENURE AT CASCADIA. 6 Q. TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE HAS HE EVER LIED ABOUT YOU 7 WITH REGARD TO YOUR WORK AT CASCADIA? 8 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTIONS. SAME 9 INSTRUCTION. (MARK). 10 BY MR. COZAD: 11 Q. WHO WAS THE HEAD OF THE PERSONNEL SEARCH AT 12 CASCADIA? 13 A. THE HEAD OF THE -- I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN. 14 Q. SURE. WHEN YOU WERE HIRED ON AT CASCADIA, WAS 15 THERE A WOMAN WHO HEADED THE SEARCH FOR THE JOB POSITION 16 YOU ULTIMATELY GOT? 17 A. OH, YOU MEAN THE HEADHUNTER FIRM? IT WAS THE 18 FIRM OF A MAN AND A WOMAN. 19 Q. WELL I'M LOOKING FOR SOMEBODY NAMED BARBARA 20 EMPLOYED BY MIRACOSTA COLLEGE -- I'M SORRY EMPLOYED BY 21 CASCADIA AND SHE WAS IN CHARGE OF THE PERSONNEL SEARCH. 22 A. I ANSWERED THE QUESTION THAT THE PERSONNEL 23 SEARCH, THE HEADHUNTER FIRM WAS THE FIRM OF A MAN AND A 24 WOMAN. 25 Q. AND THEIR NAMES? 350 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. KERR AND KHECTR. 2 Q. I'M SORRY? 3 A. KERR AND KHECTR. 4 Q. COULD YOU SPELL THAT PLEASE? 5 A. I THINK K-E-R-R, AND I DON'T KNOW IF IT WAS C 6 H OR K-H-C-T-R [SIC] KHECTR. 7 Q. AND THE WOMAN'S FIRST NAME? 8 A. BARBARA. I DON'T REMEMBER THE GENTLEMAN'S 9 FIRST NAME. 10 Q. HOW MANY VPS WERE THERE AT CASCADIA THE FIRST 11 TWO YEARS? 12 A. YOU MEAN HOW MANY VPS WERE HIRED? 13 Q. YES. 14 A. I DON'T REMEMBER EXACTLY. THERE WERE ONE, 15 TWO, THREE. THREE I WOULD THINK. 16 Q. WERE THERE SIX? 17 A. SIX VPS. 18 Q. SIX. 19 A. NO THERE WAS ONLY A VICE PRESIDENT OF 20 INSTRUCTION -- WELL WE HAD DIFFERENT NAMES AT CASCADIA. 21 BUT IT WAS INSTRUCTION, STUDENTS SERVICES AND BUSINESS. 22 Q. WAS THERE A VP OF INSTRUCTION NAMED RON? 23 A. YES. 24 Q. WHAT'S RON'S LAST NAME? 25 A. I DON'T REMEMBER. 351 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. DID RON LEAVE CASCADIA WHILE YOU WERE THERE? 2 A. HE DID. 3 Q. DID YOU FIRE HIM? 4 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, NOT REASONABLY 5 CALCULATED TO LEAD TO DISCOVERY OF ADMISSIBLE EVIDENCE. 6 OUTSIDE THE COURT'S ORDER. FURTHER, IT MAY VIOLATE THE 7 RIGHT TO PRIVACY OF RON FOR WHATEVER REASON. BUT AS 8 STATED, WITH THE FOLLOWING OBJECTIONS, I'M GOING TO 9 INSTRUCT THE WITNESS NOT TO ANSWER THE QUESTION. 10 (MARK). 11 BY MR. COZAD: 12 Q. WAS THERE A VP OF INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY NAMED 13 ERNIE AT CASCADIA WHILE YOU WERE THERE? 14 A. YES. 15 Q. DID YOU ENGAGE IN A HEATED EXCHANGE WITH ERNIE 16 AT A MEETING IN ARIZONA? 17 MR. WINET: OBJECTION NOT REASONABLY 18 CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF ADMISSIBLE 19 EVIDENCE IN THIS CASE OUTSIDE THE COURT'S ORDER MAY 20 VIOLATE ONE OR MORE PERSON'S RIGHT TO PRIVACY. I'LL 21 INSTRUCT THE WITNESS NOT TO ANSWER. (MARK). 22 BY MR. COZAD: 23 Q. DID ERNIE QUIT HIS POSITION SHORTLY AFTER THE 24 MEETING IN ARIZONA? 25 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION. SAME INSTRUCTION. 352 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 (MARK). 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. WHO IS JACK BAUTCH BA U T C H? 4 A. HE WAS THE VICE PRESIDENT OF STUDENTS OR 5 STUDENTS SERVICES -- STUDENTS -- I CAN'T REMEMBER THE 6 WAY WE USED TO CALL VICE PRESIDENTS. STUDENT LEARNING 7 STUDENT SERVICES. 8 Q. IS HE STUDYING TO BE A PRIEST? 9 A. IS HE STUDYING -- 10 Q. WAS HE STUDYING TO BE A PRIEST AT THE TIME YOU 11 WERE AT CASCADIA? 12 A. I DON'T THINK SO. I DON'T -- I DON'T THINK 13 SO. 14 Q. OKAY. DID HE QUIT AT CASCADIA WHILE YOU WERE 15 THERE? 16 MR. WINET: OBJECTION NOT REASONABLY 17 CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF ADMISSIBLE 18 EVIDENCE OUTSIDE THIS COURT'S ORDER. FURTHER, IT MAY 19 VIOLATE ONE OR MORE PERSON'S RIGHT TO PRIVACY. I'LL 20 INSTRUCT THE WITNESS NOT TO ANSWER. (MARK). 21 BY MR. COZAD: 22 Q. WHO IS SANDRA SCHROEDER? 23 A. I DON'T RECALL. MAYBE SHE WAS HIRED AFTER I 24 LEFT. 25 Q. WHAT IS THE FUNCTION OF THE NORTHWEST 353 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 ACCREDITATION BOARD? 2 MR. WINET: OBJECTION NOT REASONABLY 3 CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF ADMISSIBLE 4 EVIDENCE IN THIS CASE. OUTSIDE THE SCOPE OF THE COURT'S 5 ORDER IN THIS CASE. INSTRUCT THE WITNESS NOT TO ANSWER. 6 (MARK). 7 BY MR. COZAD: 8 Q. DID THE NORTHWEST ACCREDITATION BOARD MAKE 9 FINDINGS THAT THE ADMINISTRATION AT CASCADIA DID NOT 10 FOSTER A SENSE OF COLLEGIALITY AND THAT THAT WAS 11 INTERFERING WITH STUDENTS LEARNING? 12 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION. SAME INSTRUCTION. 13 (MARK). 14 BY MR. COZAD: 15 Q. DID THE NORTHWEST ACCREDITATION BOARD 16 CRITICIZE YOU WHILE YOU WERE AT CASCADIA THAT THE LACK 17 OF COLLEGIALITY WAS INTERFERING WITH STUDENTS LEARNING? 18 MR. WINET: YOU CAN ANSWER THAT QUESTION. 19 A. I DON'T RECALL THEM DOING THAT, NO. 20 BY MR. COZAD: 21 Q. DID THE FACULTY MEMBERS AT CASCADIA ABOUT THE 22 TIME A NORTHWEST ACCREDITATION BOARD MET WITH YOU DID 23 THE FACULTY MEMBERS COMPLAIN THAT YOU WERE HEAVY HANDED? 24 MR. WINET: OBJECTION NOT REASONABLY 25 CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF ADMISSIBLE 354 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 EVIDENCE IN THIS CASE. OUTSIDE THE COURT'S ORDER. 2 INSTRUCT YOU NOT TO ANSWER. (MARK). 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. WHO IS DONNA THOMPSON? 5 A. DONNA THOMPSON I THINK SHE WAS AN ENGLISH 6 TEACHER. AND I THINK SHE WAS THE HEAD OF THE FACULTY 7 UNION. 8 Q. DID SHE LEAVE CASCADIA DURING YOUR SERVICE 9 THERE? 10 MR. WINET: SAME OBJECTION, SAME INSTRUCTION. 11 (MARK.) 12 BY MR. COZAD: 13 Q. WHO IS PHILLIP YOCKEY, Y-O-C-K-E-Y? 14 A. I DON'T KNOW. 15 BY MR. COZAD: 16 Q. OKAY. LET'S SHOW YOU WHAT WE WILL MARK AS 17 EXHIBIT 53. 18 (EXHIBIT 53 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 19 BY MR. COZAD: 20 Q. DID THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY REPORT THAT THEY 21 ONLY FOUND $306 IN FRAUDULENT TRANSACTIONS ARISING FROM 22 THE PALM TREE INVESTIGATION? 23 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION MISSTATES 24 THE INVESTIGATION, LACKS FOUNDATION AS STATED THAT THEY 25 ONLY FOUND. YOU CAN ANSWER. 355 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY 2 STATED. 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. ON OR ABOUT MAY 24, 2007, THE UNION-TRIBUNE 5 REPORTED, DID THEY NOT, THAT ONLY $306 OF FRAUD HAS BEEN 6 PROSECUTED? 7 MR. WINET: WELL, OBJECTION. FIRST OF ALL, 8 WHAT THE UNION-TRIBUE DECIDES TO PRINT IS NOT REASONABLY 9 CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF ADMISSIBLE 10 EVIDENCE. IT ALSO MISSTATES THE INVESTIGATION AND THE 11 INFORMATION FOUND. IF YOUR QUESTION IS, IS THIS WHAT 12 THEY PRINTED, YOU CAN TESTIFY AS TO WHETHER THIS IS WHAT 13 THEY PRINTED. SO GO AHEAD. 14 A. WELL I SEE BEFORE ME ON EXHIBIT 53 A COPY OF 15 THE ONLINE VERSION OF AN ARTICLE WRITTEN BY LOLA SHERMAN 16 IN WHICH SHE SAYS THAT. "PLEADED GUILTY THIS MONTH TO 17 FELONY GRAND THEFT FOR PAYING HER FORMER FIANCE $306 18 MORE THAN SOME PALM TREES SOLD ON HIS BEHALF HAD 19 ACTUALLY NETTED." 20 BY MR. COZAD: 21 Q. THEN ON MAY 24, 2007, DID THE SAME ARTICLE 22 CONTAIN THE FOLLOWING PASSAGE: "TRUSTEES JUDY STRATTAN 23 AND AND GLORIA CARRANZA SAID YESTERDAY THAT THEY ARE 24 STARTING THE PROCESS TO PUT AN ITEM ON THE BOARD AGENDA 25 TO CONSIDER REMOVING RICHART WHO HAS BEEN PRESIDENT 356 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 SINCE AUGUST 2004"? 2 MR. WINET: OBJECTION. 3 MR. COZAD: NOW -- 4 MR. WINET: ARE YOU THROUGH? 5 BY MR. COZAD: 6 Q. IS THAT -- WAS THAT PRINTED ON OR ABOUT MAY 7 24, 2007? 8 A. THAT IS MY UNDERSTANDING, YES. 9 Q. WAS THERE SOME POINT AFTER THAT A RETRACTION 10 BY THE UNION-TRIBUNE OF PART OF THAT STATEMENT? 11 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, MAY CALL FOR 12 SPECULATION. MAY LACK FOUNDATION AS TO THIS WITNESS. 13 ANSWER WHAT YOU KNOW. 14 A. I AM NOT AWARE OF ANY RETRACTION, NO. I'M 15 SORRY. 16 MR. COZAD: LET'S TAKE A SHORT BREAK. I WANT 17 TO CLEAN THIS UP HERE. 18 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: ALL RIGHT. GOING OFF THE 19 RECORD AT 448. 20 (RECESS). 21 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: ALL RIGHT WE'RE BACK ON THE 22 RECORD AT 456. 23 BY MR. COZAD: 24 BY MR. COZAD: 25 MR. COZAD: LET'S SHOW YOU WHAT WE WILL MARK 357 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 AS EXHIBIT 54. 2 (EXHIBIT 54 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. DID YOU AUTHORIZE MR. OTTILIE TO WRITE THIS 5 LETTER ON YOUR BEHALF? 6 MR. WINET: OBJECTION MAY INVADE THE 7 ATTORNEY-CLIENT PRIVILEGE. AS LONG AS YOU DON'T DISCUSS 8 THE CONVERSATION YOU HAD WITH HIM YOU CAN ANSWER. 9 A. I KNEW ABOUT THE LETTER. I DON'T -- I DID NOT 10 AUTHORIZE THE SPECIFIC WORDS. 11 BY MR. COZAD: 12 Q. DID YOU GET A COPY OF THE LETTER ON OR ABOUT 13 MAY 17, 2007? 14 A. YES. 15 Q. DID YOU APPROVE OF THE CONTENT? 16 A. YES. 17 Q. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE WILL MARK AS 18 EXHIBIT 55. 19 (EXHIBIT 55 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 20 BY MR. COZAD: 21 Q. DID VICE PRESIDENT OF INSTRUCTIONAL SERVICES, 22 JULIE HATOFF FILE A LAWSUIT AGAINST YOU IN VISTA ON OR 23 ABOUT MAY 30TH, 2007? 24 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION MAY LACKS 25 FOUNDATION, CALLS FOR SPECULATION BY THIS WITNESS AS TO 358 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 THE DATE OF THE FILING. YOU CAN GO AHEAD AND ANSWER. 2 A. I DON'T KNOW THE DATE OF THE FILING. 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. SOMETIME AROUND MAY 30TH, 2007? 5 A. I DON'T KNOW, I DON'T KNOW. 6 Q. DID MS. HATOFF CLAIM IN HER LAWSUIT THAT THE 7 COLLEGE'S ATTORNEY TRIED TO INTIMIDATE HER INTO 8 RESIGNING? 9 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE LAWSUIT SPEAKS FOR 10 ITSELF. YOU CAN TESTIFY AS TO WHAT YOUR MEMORY IS OF 11 WHAT THE LAWSUIT SAYS. 12 A. I DON'T RECALL A LAWSUIT. I'M SORRY. 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. DID MS. HATOFF ALLEGE THAT YOU SYSTEMLY 15 ATTEMPTED TO RUIN HER REPUTATION WITHIN THE COLLEGE 16 COMMUNITY AND STATE WIDE? 17 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE LAWSUIT SPEAKS FOR 18 ITSELF. TO THE EXTENT THAT YOU RECALL WHAT THE LAWSUIT 19 SPECIFICALLY SAID IN RESPONSE TO THE QUESTION, GO AHEAD. 20 A. I DON'T RECALL MS. HATOFF FILED MANY, MANY 21 DIFFERENT VERSIONS OF THE LAWSUIT AND TORT CLAIMS. SO I 22 DON'T KNOW -- YOU'RE READING FROM EXHIBIT 55 WHICH IS A 23 REPORT BY LOLA SHERMAN OF THE SAN DIEGO TRIBUNE FROM A 24 COPY OF ON LINE ARTICLE. AND I DON'T KNOW THE DETAILS 25 OF THE LAWSUIT. I'M SORRY. 359 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. OKAY. NOTWITHSTANDING THE LAWSUIT THOUGH, DID 3 MS. HATOFF PUBLICLY STATE TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE THAT YOU 4 SYSTEMATICALLY ATTEMPTED TO RUIN HER REPUTATION WITHIN 5 THE COLLEGE COMMUNITY AND STATE WIDE? 6 A. I DON'T HAVE KNOWLEDGE OF THAT. 7 Q. TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE DID MS. HATOFF STATE 8 PUBLICLY THAT SHE SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN FIRED AND THAT 9 SHE HAD NEVER RECEIVED AN UNSATISFACTORY EVALUATION 10 DURING HER 36 YEARS AS A TEACHER AND ADMINISTRATOR AT 11 MIRACOSTA? 12 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, THE QUESTION IS 13 COMPOUND. ALSO ASKS THE WITNESS TO SPECULATE. YOU CAN 14 ANSWER WHAT YOU KNOW. 15 A. YOU'RE ASKING ME IF I KNEW THAT SHE SAID THAT 16 PUBLICLY? 17 BY MR. COZAD: 18 Q. YES. 19 A. I DON'T RECALL THAT. 20 Q. DID SHE EVER SAY PRIVATELY TO YOU THAT SHE 21 NEVER RECEIVED AN UNSATISFACTORY EVALUATION DURING HER 22 36 YEARS AS A TEACHER AND ADMINISTER AT MIRACOSTA? 23 A. NO, SHE DID NOT. 24 Q. DID YOU EVER DETERMINE WHETHER MS. HATOFF EVER 25 RECEIVED AN UNSATISFACTORY EVALUATION DURING HER 36 360 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 YEARS AS A TEACHER AND ADMINISTRATOR AT MIRACOSTA? 2 A. DID I DETERMINE? ARE YOU ASKING ME IF I 3 DETERMINED THAT SHE HAD HAD THAT? 4 Q. YES, MA'AM. 5 A. YES, I DID. 6 Q. AND TO YOUR KNOWLEDGE DID SHE EVER RECEIVE AN 7 UNSATISFACTORY EVALUATION DURING HER 36 YEARS AS A 8 TEACHER AND ADMINISTRATOR AT MIRACOSTA? 9 A. I DON'T THINK I'M AT LIBERTY TO DISCLOSE HER 10 PERSONNEL ISSUES. 11 MR. WINET: YOU ARE NOT. 12 A. IT WILL VIOLATE HER PRIVACY RIGHTS. 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. DO YOU THINK THAT SHE WAIVED HER PRIVACY 15 RIGHTS AND HER EVALUATIONS BY MAKING THE PUBLIC 16 STATEMENTS TO THE PRESS ON OR ABOUT MAY 30TH, 2007 THAT 17 SHE NEVER RECEIVED AN UNSATISFACTORY EVALUATION DURING 18 HER 36 YEARS AT MIRACOSTA? 19 MR. WINET: OBJECTION. 20 MR. SLEETH: OBJECTION, CALLS FOR LEGAL 21 CONCLUSION. 22 MR. WINET: IT DOES. IT CALLS FOR A PURE 23 LEGAL CONCLUSION AND THIS WITNESS IS NOT GOING TO BE 24 TESTIFYING AS TO WHAT HER LEGAL OPINION IS AS TO WHETHER 25 THERE WAS A WAIVER OR NOT BY MS. HATOFF. SECONDLY, IT'S 361 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 NOT REASONABLY CALCULATED TO LEAD TO THE DISCOVERY OF 2 ADMISSIBLE EVIDENCE IN THIS CASE. THIRD, IT'S OUTSIDE 3 THIS COURT'S ORDER. I INSTRUCT THE WITNESS NOT TO 4 ANSWER. (MARK). 5 BY MR. COZAD: 6 Q. WHO REPRESENTED YOU IN THE HATOFF CASE? 7 A. MR. WINET. 8 MR. WINET: I HEARD SHE HAD REALLY GOOD 9 COUNSEL. 10 MR. COZAD: SHE DID. 11 Q. DID YOU TELL THE UNION-TRIBUNE ON OR ABOUT 12 MAY 30TH, 2007 ABOUT THE AMOUNT OF MONEY SPENT ON THE 13 PALM TREE INVESTIGATION WAS CLOSE TO $200,000? 14 MR. SLEETH: OBJECTION MISSTATES THE REPORT 15 THAT YOU'RE READING FROM. 16 MR. WINET: OH I SEE IT IT'S ABOUT FOUR OR 17 FIVE LINES FROM THE BOTTOM THERE'S A REFERENCE TO IT. 18 SO GO AHEAD AND REVIEW IT AND THEN ANSWER THE QUESTION. 19 A. I DON'T RECALL SPECIFICALLY SAYING ANYTHING TO 20 THE UNION-TRIBUNE ABOUT THIS. I MADE, AS I HAVE ALREADY 21 TESTIFIED IN MY DEPOSITION, LAST FRIDAY, I MADE SEVERAL 22 PRESENTATIONS IN PUBLIC MEETINGS TO THE BOARD AS TO THE 23 COST INCURRED IN THE INVESTIGATION. 24 BY MR. COZAD: 25 Q. LET'S SHOW YOU WHAT WE WILL MARK AS 362 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 EXHIBIT 56. 2 (EXHIBIT 56 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 3 MR. COZAD: 4 MR. WINET: DO GOT ONE MORE AH THANKS. 5 MR. COZAD: SORRY. 6 MR. SLEETH: SHORT ONE MORE. 7 BY MR. COZAD: 8 Q. ON OR ABOUT JUNE 2ND, 2007, WAS IT REPORTED 9 THAT A HATE CRIME WAS COMMITTED AT THE HOME OF BOARD 10 PRESIDENT CHARLES ADAMS. 11 A. I DON'T RECALL EXACTLY THE DATE BUT, YES, IT 12 WAS. AROUND THAT TIME. 13 Q. DO YOU HAVE ANY INFORMATION THAT LEADS YOU TO 14 BELIEVE THAT ANY MINORITY TRUSTEES ON THE BOARD OF 15 MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY COLLEGE PLAYED ANY ROLE WHATSOEVER 16 IN THIS REPORTED HATE CRIME AT THE HOME OF MR. ADAMS? 17 MR. WINET: OBJECTION THE QUESTION IS 18 OVERBROAD. CALLS FOR SPECULATION. LACKS FOUNDATION. 19 YOU CAN ANSWER. 20 A. YOU'RE ASKING ME IF I BELIEVE THAT ANY OTHER 21 TRUSTEE WAS THE ONE THAT COMMITTED THIS HATE CRIME? 22 BY MR. COZAD: 23 Q. LET ME HAVE THE COURT REPORTER READ MY 24 QUESTION. 25 (LAST QUESTION READ.) 363 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. NO. 2 BY MR. COZAD: 3 Q. ON OR ABOUT JUNE 2ND, 2007 DID ONE OR MORE OF 4 THE MINORITY TRUSTEES AT MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY COLLEGE 5 REQUEST THAT THE BOARD CONSIDER A MEASURE TO REMOVE YOU 6 FROM OFFICE? 7 MR. WINET: I'M SORRY CAN I HAVE THE QUESTION 8 READ BACK AGAIN I JUST DIDN'T HEAR IT. 9 (LAST QUESTION READ.) 10 A. I DON'T RECALL THE EXACT DATE BUT I DO RECALL 11 THE EFFECT OF THE INTERVIEW, I GUESS IT WAS, OF THE -- 12 ON MAY 24TH BY THE UNION-TRIBUNE WHERE TRUST TREE 13 STRATTAN AND CARRANZA CARRANZA SPOKE OF PLACING AN 14 AGENDA ITEM FOR CONSIDERATION FOR MY REMOVAL. I ALSO 15 REMEMBER I THINK IT WAS ON JUNE 2ND OR SO, THEREABOUTS 16 TRUSTEE SIMON GAVE AN INTERVIEW TO THE UNION-TRIBUNE IN 17 WHICH HE ASKED THAT THE LETTER FROM THE FORMER EMPLOYEES 18 BE READ -- SHE WAS GOING TO ASK FOR THE FORMAL LETTER OF 19 THE EMPLOYEES TO BE ADDRESSED AT A PUBLIC MEETING AT THE 20 BOARD OF TRUSTEES. SHE SUBSEQUENTLY DID SO ON THE BOARD 21 MEETING OF JUNE 5TH. AND TRUSTEES STRATTAN AND CARRANZA 22 VOTED IN FAVOR OF THAT. THE OTHER TRUSTEES VOTED 23 AGAINST AND THE MOTION FAILED. 24 (EXHIBIT 57 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 25 364 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. I'M NOW REFERRING TO EXHIBIT 57. DID YOU READ 3 THIS ARTICLE ON OR ABOUT JUNE 2ND, 2007? 4 A. YES. I READ AN ARTICLE NOT NECESSARILY THIS 5 ONE IN PARTICULAR BUT A SIMILAR ARTICLE. I MEAN AN 6 ARTICLE FROM THE UNION-TRIBUNE, YES. 7 Q. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE WILL MARK AS 8 EXHIBIT 58. 9 (EXHIBIT 58 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 10 BY MR. COZAD: 11 Q. ON OR ABOUT JUNE 6, 2007, DID YOU ADDRESS AN 12 E-MAIL TO THE MIRACOSTA FACULTY AND STAFF CONCERNING 13 COMMENTS MADE BY PRESIDENT ADAMS THE DAY BEFORE? 14 A. I HAVE -- YES, I DO REMEMBER SENDING SOMETHING 15 TO THE COLLEGE. I'M NOT SURE THIS IS THE DOCUMENT I 16 SENT THOUGH. IT'S NOT AN E-MAIL FORMAT. IT DOESN'T 17 HAVE A DATE. AND I WOULDN'T -- I DON'T KNOW IF THIS 18 IS -- THIS EXHIBIT 58 REPRESENTS WHAT I WROTE IN 19 TOTALITY. 20 Q. ON OR ABOUT JUNE 6, 2007, DID YOU SAY IN AN 21 E-MAIL TO THE MIRACOSTA FACULTY AND STAFF QUOTE I 22 RECEIVED THREATS IN THE PAST BUT THIS ONE WAS 23 DIFFERENT?" DID YOU SAY THOSE WORDS? 24 A. I DON'T KNOW WHERE YOU'RE READING. 25 MR. WINET: IT'S THE BOTTOM PARAGRAPH. GO 365 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 AHEAD AND READ THE WHOLE DOCUMENT IN CONTEXT. AND THEN 2 GO AHEAD AND ANSWER HIS -- I'M NOT SURE THAT THE 3 QUESTION WAS COMPLETE. 4 A. YES, I REMEMBER WRITING THAT, YES UH-HUH. 5 BY MR. COZAD: 6 Q. HOW MANY THREATS DID YOU RECEIVE IN THE PAST? 7 A. AT MIRACOSTA I HAD RECEIVED SEVERAL THREATS 8 FROM A STUDENT WHO WAS NOT WELL MENTALLY. AND WE HAD 9 HAD TO LOCK DOWN THE ADMINISTRATION BUILDING A COUPLE 10 TIMES AS A RESULT OF THAT. HE WAS THEN -- SUBSEQUENTLY 11 HE'S BEEN -- WAS PLACED -- WAS IN JAIL AND THEN HAS BEEN 12 RECEIVING MEDICAL TREATMENT. 13 Q. OKAY. ANY OTHER THREATS THAT YOU HAD RECEIVED 14 AT MIRACOSTA OTHER THAN FROM THIS PERSON THAT YOU 15 DESCRIBED AS NOT BEING WELL? 16 MR. WINET: LET ME OBJECT. THE QUESTION TO 17 SOME EXTENT HAS ALREADY BEEN ASKED AND ANSWERED IN PRIOR 18 SESSIONS OF THE DEPOSITION, SO TO THAT EXTENT IT'S BEEN 19 ASKED AND ANSWERED. YOU CAN GO AHEAD AND ANSWER. 20 A. WELL, JUST OTHER THAN WHAT I SAID BEFORE 21 NOTHING ELSE. 22 BY MR. COZAD: 23 Q. HAD YOU RECEIVED THREATS AGAINST YOU WHILE YOU 24 WERE AT CASCADIA? 25 A. I DON'T RECALL, NO, HUH-UH. 366 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. DID YOU RECEIVE THREATS AGAINST YOU WHILE YOU 2 WERE AT LOS ANGELES COMMUNITY COLLEGE DISTRICT? 3 A. I DON'T RECALL. 4 Q. WHO IS PATRICK CONNELLY? 5 A. I THINK HE'S A FACULTY MEMBER AT MIRACOSTA. 6 Q. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE WILL MARK AS EXHIBIT 7 59 IT APPEARS TO BE A DOCUMENT ENTITLED COLLEGE TRUSTEES 8 HOLD THE LINE ON FACULTY SALARIES. 9 (EXHIBIT 59 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 10 A. THERE'S AN EXTRA COPY THERE. 11 BY MR. COZAD: 12 Q. DID YOU PARTICIPATE IN THE DRAFTING OF THIS 13 DOCUMENT? 14 A. NO. 15 Q. DID YOU PARTICIPATE IN THE DISSEMINATION OF 16 THIS DOCUMENT? 17 A. YES. 18 Q. WHAT DID YOU DO IN CONNECTION WITH THE 19 DISSEMINATION OF THIS DOCUMENT? 20 A. I HANDED IT TO THE REPORTERS FROM THE NORTH 21 COUNTY TIMES AND THE SAN DIEGO TRIBUNE. I'M NOT SURE 22 THAT IT'S EXACTLY THIS PARTICULAR COPY THAT YOU HAVE 23 GIVEN ME, BUT SOMETHING TO THIS EFFECT. 24 Q. WHEN WAS IT THAT YOU GAVE THE DOCUMENT TO THE 25 PRESS? 367 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. DURING THE BOARD MEETING AFTER THE BOARD HAD 2 ADOPTED THE SALARY AGREEMENT AND THE WORKLOAD AGREEMENT. 3 Q. NOW THIS DOCUMENT PURPORTS TO LEVEL SOME 4 CRITICISM AT THE PREVIOUS VP OF INSTRUCTION, ISN'T THAT 5 SO? 6 A. ARE YOU REFERRING TO THE SENTENCE AT THE 7 BOTTOM OF THE PARAGRAPH THAT'S THE LAST PARAGRAPH FIRST 8 PAGE? IT IS A COMMENTS WE FEEL -- IT'S IN QUOTES WE 9 FEEL THAT IT IS ONLY FAIR FOR A FACULTY TO KNOW THE 10 EXPECTATIONS OF A JOB THEY ARE UNDERTAKING AND THEY 11 UNDERSTAND HOW THE JOB IS TO BE DEFINED FROM YEAR TO 12 YEAR. ADAMS SAID. THE QUOTES CONTINUE. "THE POSITION 13 OF VICE PRESIDENT OF INSTRUCTION NO LONGER HAS THE 14 LATITUDE TO SHORTEN OR LENGTHEN THE FACULTY MEMBERS 15 WORKWEEK. ALL OF THAT IS NOT DEFINED IN BOARD POLICY. 16 IS THAT WHAT REFERRING TO? 17 Q. SURE. 18 A. THAT IS A QUOTE FROM MR. ADAMS. 19 Q. OKAY. DID MR. ADAMS PREPARE THIS? 20 MR. WINET: OBJECTION MAY CALLS FOR 21 SPECULATION. GO AHEAD AND ANSWER TO THE EXTENT YOU CAN. 22 A. I CANNOT ANSWER THAT QUESTION. 23 BY MR. COZAD: 24 Q. WHO PREPARED IT? 25 A. I DON'T KNOW. 368 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. WAS IT PREPARED BY A TRUSTEE OF THE COLLEGE? 2 A. I THINK THAT MY ANSWERING THESE QUESTIONS I 3 WOULD BE VIOLATING CLOSED SESSION INFORMATION. 4 Q. DO YOU KNOW WHO PREPARED IT? 5 MR. WINET: YOU CAN ANSWER THAT WITH A YES OR 6 A NO. 7 A. YES. 8 BY MR. COZAD: 9 Q. DID MR. SHINOFF PREPARE IT? 10 MR. WINET: YOU CAN ANSWER THAT WITH A YES OR 11 A NO. 12 A. NO. 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. DID MR. ADAMS PREPARE IT? 15 MR. WINET: NOW WE'RE GOING INTO ISSUES 16 INVOLVING CLOSED SESSION. SO I'LL HAVE TO INSTRUCT HER 17 NOT TO ANSWER. (MARK). 18 BY MR. COZAD: 19 Q. THE AUTHOR, WHOEVER IT IS, OF THIS DOCUMENT 20 SUGGESTS THAT PAST PRACTICES AT MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY 21 COLLEGE ENCOURAGED FINANCIAL FAVORITISM AND SPECIAL 22 DEALS FOR A PREFERRED FACULTY MEMBERS. CORRECT? 23 A. THAT'S CORRECT. THAT WAS ALSO STATED PUBLICLY 24 AT THE BOARD MEETING WHEN THE WORKLOAD AGREEMENT WAS 25 BEING CONSIDERED BY THE BOARD FOR A VOTE. 369 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. AND YOU CONSIDERED THAT TO BE A CRITICISM OF 2 THE OFFICE OF INSTRUCTION? 3 A. I CONSIDER THAT TO BE AN ACCURATE STATEMENT OF 4 WHAT HAD TRANSPIRED IN THE PAST AT MIRACOSTA COLLEGE. 5 Q. WHO WAS THE VICE PRESIDENT IN THE OFFICE OF 6 INSTRUCTION AT THAT TIME -- I'M SORRY -- THE PREVIOUS 7 VICE PRESIDENT FOR INSTRUCTION THAT'S REFERRED TO IN 8 THIS MEMORANDUM? 9 A. I WOULD IMAGINE THE ONLY VICE PRESIDENT FOR 10 INSTRUCTION THAT HAS BEEN THERE FOR MANY YEARS IS MS. 11 HATOFF. THE OTHER VICE PRESIDENT WAS ACTING VICE 12 PRESIDENT, MR. ROBERTSON DURING HER PAID LEAVE OF 13 ABSENCE. 14 Q. WAS, WAS THIS A PRESS RELEASE? 15 A. I THOUGHT IT WAS A PRESS RELEASE AT THE TIME, 16 YES. I HAD ASKED MY PUBLIC INFORMATION OFFICE TO 17 PREPARE A PRESS RELEASE TO BE ISSUED TO THE PRESS AT THE 18 CONCLUSION OF THE VOTE BY THE BOARD SO THAT THE PRESS 19 WOULD HAVE SPECIFIC INFORMATION. I ELICITED A BREAK. I 20 CAME BACK TO MY SEAT. THE PRESS RELEASE WAS IN FRONT OF 21 ME. AND SO I -- WHEN THE VOTE WAS TAKEN I STOOD UP. IN 22 THE MIDDLE OF A PUBLIC MEETING AND I WENT TO THE BACK OF 23 THE ROOM AND HANDED IT TO THE REPORTERS. 24 Q. WAS IT ON SCHOOL LETTERHEAD? 25 A. I DON'T RECALL. 370 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. WAS IT SIGNED? 2 A. I DON'T THINK PRESS RELEASES ARE NORMALLY 3 SIGNED. 4 Q. PRESS RELEASES NORMALLY HAVE A CONTACT LINE, 5 DON'T THEY? 6 A. YES. 7 Q. FOR -- 8 A. YES. 9 Q. IN FACT? 10 A. NORMALLY YES. 11 Q. HAD YOU EVER SEEN A PRESS RELEASE BEFORE THAT 12 DIDN'T HAVE A LINE THAT SAID FOR FURTHER INFORMATION 13 CONTACT SOMEBODY AND A PHONE NUMBER? 14 A. MR. COZAD, I DIDN'T PROOFREAD THE PRESS 15 RELEASE BEFORE I ISSUED IT TO THE PRESS. I THOUGHT THIS 16 IS WHAT I HAD ASKED FROM MY STAFF. IT WAS IN THE MIDDLE 17 OF THE BOARD MEETING. I HAD MORE WORK TO DO. I 18 SPECIFICALLY JUST DID THAT AT A GIVEN BREAK. THAT'S ALL 19 I CAN TELL YOU. 20 Q. DID ANY FACULTY MEMBERS ASK YOU FOR A COPY OF 21 THIS PRESS RELEASE BEFORE IT WAS ISSUED? 22 A. NO. 23 Q. DID YOU TELL ANY FACULTY MEMBERS THAT YOU DID 24 NOT KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT A PRESS RELEASES -- 25 A. I'M SORRY? CAN YOU REPEAT THE QUESTION? 371 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. PRIOR TO THE ISSUANCE OF THIS PRESS RELEASE 2 DID YOU TELL ANY FACULTY MEMBERS THAT YOU DIDN'T KNOW 3 THAT IT EXISTED? 4 A. PRIOR TO THE ISSUANCE? YOU MEAN PRIOR TO ME 5 HANDING IT OVER TO THE PRESS? 6 Q. YES, MA'AM? 7 A. DID I TELL THE FACULTY THAT I DIDN'T KNOW 8 THERE WAS A PRESS RELEASE? 9 Q. CAN YOU ANSWER MY QUESTION AS I PHRASED IT? 10 MR. WINET: WELL WELL THE WITNESS IS TRYING TO 11 GET CLARIFICATION. SO YOUR QUESTION IS NOW 12 ARGUMENTATIVE I'LL ASK YOU TO RESTATE IT SO THAT 13 HOPEFULLY YOU AND THE WITNESS ARE OP THE SAME SHEET OF 14 MUSIC. 15 MR. COZAD: LET'S GET SOMETHING CLEAR HERE 16 THIS WITNESS HAS HABIT OF REPHRASING MY QUESTION AND 17 THEN ANSWERING THE QUESTION THAT SHE WANTS TO ANSWER. 18 MR. WINET: LET'S -- 19 MR. COZAD: NOT THE ONE THAT I ASK. 20 MR. WINET: LET'S GET IT CLEAR HERE. YOU ARE 21 NOT GOING TO ARGUE LIKE THIS AT THE DEPOSITION. 22 MR. COZAD: THAT'S FINE. 23 MR. WINET: WE'LL END THE THING IF YOU WANT 24 TO, BUT YOU'RE MAKING ARGUMENTATIVE AND IMPROPER 25 STATEMENTS LIKE YOU JUST DID IS NOT ONLY IMPROPER BUT 372 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 IT'S ALSO BADGERING THE WITNESS AND INAPPROPRIATE IN A 2 DEPOSITION. 3 ASK YOUR NEXT QUESTION. 4 BY MR. COZAD: 5 Q. AT THE TIME THAT YOU GAVE THE PRESS RELEASE TO 6 THE UNION-TRIBUNE AND THE NORTH COUNTY TIMES DID YOU 7 KNOW WHAT THE SUBJECT OF THE PRESS RELEASE WAS? 8 A. I HAVE ALREADY RESPOND THAT HAD I ASSUMED THAT 9 THIS WAS WHAT I HAD ASKED MY PUBLIC INFORMATION OFFICE 10 TO PREPARE, WHICH WAS THE SUMMARY OF WHAT HAD -- WHAT 11 WAS ABOUT TO HAPPEN AT THE BOARD MEETINGS SO THAT THE 12 PRESS WOULD HAVE SOME FIGURES BEFORE THEM AND SOME 13 HISTORY BEHIND IT. 14 Q. ISN'T IT TRUE THAT YOU DID PARTICIPATE IN THE 15 WRITING OF THE PRESS RELEASE? 16 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, ARGUMENTATIVE. GO 17 AHEAD. 18 A. IT IS NOT TRUE. 19 BY MR. COZAD: 20 Q. ISN'T IT TRUE THAT WHEN ASKED ABOUT THE ORIGIN 21 OF THE PRESS RELEASE ON OR ABOUT JULY 20 -- I'M SORRY ON 22 OR ABOUT JUNE 19, 2007 THAT THE BOARD PRESIDENT CHARLES 23 ADAMS STATED THAT WE DID IT. WE ALL WROTE IT. 24 GESTURING TO HIS FELLOW BOARD MEMBERS DURING THE BREAK? 25 MR. WINET: YOU CAN ANSWER THAT QUESTION 373 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 SPECIFICALLY AS IT'S PHRASED. 2 A. I DON'T RECALL MR. ADAMS SAYING THAT. 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. ISN'T IT TRUE THAT ON OR ABOUT JUNE 19, 2007 5 YOU TOLD PHILIP IRELAND STAFF WRITER OF THE NORTH COUNTY 6 TIMES QUOTE THIS IS OFFICIAL AND I STAND BEHIND EVERY 7 WORD"? 8 A. I DID SAY THAT, YES. 9 Q. AND THEN DID YOU FOLLOW-UP BY SAYING QUOTE 10 THAT'S ALL YOU NEED TO KNOW CLOSED QUOTED? 11 A. I DON'T KNOW ABOUT THAT. MR. IRELAND WANTED 12 ME TO TELL HIM WHO HAD WRITTEN THIS. AND I TOLD HIM 13 WHAT YOU JUST READ. 14 Q. LET ME SHOW WHAT YOU WE WILL ATTACH AS 15 EXHIBIT 60. 16 (EXHIBIT 60 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 17 BY MR. COZAD: 18 Q. ON OR ABOUT JUNE 19, 2007 DID THE NORTH COUNTY 19 TIMES PUBLISH THIS ARTICLE ABOUT THE ORIGINS OF THE 20 MEMORANDUM AND YOUR STATEMENTS CONCERNING IT? 21 A. I DON'T KNOW WHEN THE NORTH COUNTY TIMES 22 PUBLISHED IT. 23 Q. DID YOU TELL MR. IRELAND QUOTE I AM THE PUBLIC 24 INFORMATION OFFICE CLOSED QUOTE? 25 A. I HAVE ALREADY ANSWERED THAT QUESTION ON 374 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 PREVIOUS DEPOSITION. YOU ASKED ME THAT QUESTION ON 2 MONDAY [SIC] 3 MR. WINET: YOU DID. YOU ASKED THE EXACT SAME 4 QUESTION. SHE RESPONDED. 5 A. BUT I CAN TELL YOU THAT I NEVER TOLD 6 MR. IRELAND THAT I AUTHORED THAT DOCUMENT. NEVER. 7 BY MR. COZAD: 8 Q. ON OR ABOUT JUNE 6, 2007 DID SEVERAL CURRENT 9 AND FORMER COLLEGE ADMINISTRATORS AND FACULTY PUBLISH A 10 PAID POLITICAL ADVERTISEMENT SUGGESTING THAT YOU SHOULD 11 BE REMOVED FROM YOUR POSITION AS 12 PRESIDENT/SUPERINTENDENT OF MIRACOSTA COMMUNITY COLLEGE? 13 A. I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY THE DATE BUT SOMEWHERE 14 AROUND THAT TIME, YES. 15 Q. OKAY. LET ME SHOW WHAT YOU WE WILL ATTACH AS 16 EXHIBIT 61. 17 (EXHIBIT 61 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 18 BY MR. COZAD: 19 Q. HAVE YOU SEEN THIS BEFORE? 20 A. YES. 21 Q. THIS IS AS I SAID BY SIX FORMER COLLEGE 22 TRUSTEES 10 ADMINISTRATORS AND 18 PROFESSORS AND 23 INSTRUCTORS OF THE COLLEGE? 24 A. I HAVEN'T SEEN THEIR SIGNATURES BUT I HAVE 25 SEEN THIS PAID POLITICAL ADVERTISEMENT WITH THEIR NAMES 375 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 ON IT. 2 MR. WINET: THIS IS ACTUALLY THE FIRST TIME 3 I'VE SEEN IT AND I'VE JUST READ THE FIRST PARAGRAPH. 4 AND IT'S AMAZING. I TAKE IT YOU GUYS HAVE READ THE 5 DOCUMENT ITSELF INCLUDING THE LAST SENTENCE OF THE FIRST 6 PARAGRAPH? 7 MR. COZAD: OH GEE LET'S TAKE A LOOK AT IT AND 8 SEE. 9 MR. WINET: I THINK WE CAN DO THIS OFF THE 10 RECORD. IT'S JUST AMAZING WHAT PEOPLE WILL WRITE. 11 MR. SLEETH: YOU MEAN THE PART ABOUT THE WELL 12 INTENTION FRAUD? 13 MR. WINET: YEAH ALSO THE LOSSES BUT 3533 IT'S 14 JUST RIDICULOUS WHAT PEOPLE WILL WRITE. LIKE I SAID WE 15 CAN OFFER COVER IT OFF THE RECORD THIS DOESN'T NEED TO 16 BE DISCUSSED ON THE RECORD. 17 MR. COZAD: I MEAN THAT'S FINE. I KNOW IT'S 18 GETTING LATE. WE'RE GETTING A LITTLE PUNCHY. 19 MR. WINET: YEAH, LET'S MOVE ON. 20 MR. COZAD: BUT WE'LL -- 21 BY MR. COZAD: 22 Q. OKAY. LET'S SHOW YOU WHAT WE WILL MARK AS 23 EXHIBIT 62. 24 (EXHIBIT 62 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 25 376 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. IS THIS AN E-MAIL THAT JONATHAN COLE SENT YOU 3 ON OR ABOUT JUNE 16, 2007 ASKING YOU TO PROVIDE 4 CLARIFICATION REGARDING THE PRESS RELEASE DISTRIBUTED TO 5 REPORTERS AT THE JUNE 5 MEETING? 6 A. UH-HUH. 7 Q. YES? 8 A. YES, IT DOES. 9 Q. OKAY. 10 BY MR. COZAD: 11 Q. AND I'LL SHOW YOU WHAT WE'VE MARKED AS 63. 12 (EXHIBIT 63 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 13 BY MR. COZAD: 14 Q. ARE THESE MORE E-MAILS BETWEEN YOU AND 15 JONATHAN COLE CONCERNING THE PRESS RELEASE? 16 A. YOU'VE GIVEN ME COPIES OF AN INITIAL E-MAIL 17 FROM JONATHAN COLE TO ME ASKING ME ABOUT THE PRESS 18 RELEASE. I'M TRYING TO MAKE -- THEY SEEM TO BE REPEATED 19 BUT THEY ARE DIFFERENT SO ... 20 MR. WINET: I THINK IF WE TAKE A LOOK AT IT ON 21 EXHIBIT 63, TIMEWISE, THE FIRST E-MAIL APPEARS TO BE, AT 22 THE BOTTOM OF THE FIRST PAGE. THE SECOND E APPEARS TO 23 BE THE TOP OF THE FIRST PAGE. AND THEN THE NEXT E-MAIL 24 IS THE BOTTOM OF THE SECOND PAGE AND THE NEXT E-MAIL 25 AFTER THAT IS THE TOP OF THE SECOND PAGE. 377 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. ALL I'M TRYING TO ESTABLISH IS JUST THAT -- 3 A. WE CORRESPONDED BY E-MAIL. 4 Q. YES. 5 A. WE DID. 6 Q. GOOD ENOUGH. VERY GOOD. THANK YOU. 7 LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE WILL MARK AS EXHIBIT 8 64. 9 (EXHIBIT 64 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 10 BY MR. COZAD: 11 Q. IT APPEARS TO BE A LETTER FROM PRESIDENT 12 CHARLES ADAMS TO THE EMPLOYEES OF MIRACOSTA COLLEGE 13 CONCERNING SOME COMMENTS THAT PRESIDENT ADAMS MADE ABOUT 14 A MR. AFZALI, A-F-Z-A-L-I, AND A MR. JONATHAN COLE. 15 HAVE YOU SEEN THIS LETTER BEFORE? 16 A. YES. 17 Q. AND WHAT LED UP TO THE -- THIS APOLOGY TO 18 MR. AFZALI AND MR. COLE? 19 A. TRUSTEE ADAMS SPOKE AS A MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC 20 AWAY FROM THE A DYE YAYS ABOUT THE HATE CRIME THAT HAD 21 BEEN COMMITTED AT HIS HOME. AND HE MADE SOME 22 ACCUSATIONS AGAINST MR. AFZALI WHO WAS AT THE TIME THE 23 PRESIDENT OF THE CLASSIFIED SENATE AND OF COURSE 24 MR. JONATHAN COLE WHO'S THE PRESIDENT OF THE ACADEMIC 25 SENATE. SO THIS IS A LETTER OF APOLOGY. 378 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 BY MR. COZAD: 2 Q. DID HE PUBLICLY ACCUSE THEM OF COMMITTING THE 3 HATE CRIME AT HIS HOME? 4 A. I DON'T RECALL THAT, NO. 5 Q. DID MR. AFZALI DEMAND AN APOLOGY AND 6 RETRACTION FROM MR. ADAMS? 7 A. I DON'T REMEMBER WHETHER HE DID OR NOT. 8 Q. DID MR. ADAMS PUBLICLY APOLOGIZE TO MR. AFZALI 9 AND MR. COLE FOR MAKING ACCUSATIONS AGAINST THEM 10 REGARDING THE HATE CRIME? 11 A. WELL, HE ISSUED THIS LETTER WHICH WAS THEN 12 FORWARDED BY MY OFFICE, NOT ME, BUT MY OFFICE. IT COULD 13 HAVE BEEN ME, I DON'T REMEMBER, TO ALL OF THE COLLEGE 14 EMPLOYEES, WHICH MAKES IT PRETTY PUBLIC. 15 Q. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE WILL MARK AS 16 EXHIBIT 65. 17 (EXHIBIT 65 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 18 BY MR. COZAD: 19 Q. ON OR ABOUT JUNE 7, 2007, DID UNION-TRIBUNE 20 COLUMNNIST LOGAN JENKINS WRITE A COMMENTARY CRITICAL OF 21 THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN MIRACOSTA FACULTY AND 22 ADMINISTRATORS? 23 A. YOU HAVE JUST GIVEN ME A COPY OF A WEB 24 BASED -- EXCUSE ME ON LINE BASED COMMENTARY THAT'S DATED 25 JUNE 7. SO I ASSUME HE WROTE IT AT THAT TIME. 379 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 Q. ALL RIGHT. DO YOU RECALL SEEING THE 2 COMMENTARY ENTITLED QUOTE LET'S GET THE DEVIL EXPELLED 3 FROM COLLEGE CLOSED QUOTE? 4 A. I DON'T RECALL, NO. 5 Q. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE WILL MARK AS 6 EXHIBITS 66. 7 (EXHIBIT 66 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 8 BY MR. COZAD: 9 Q. I NOTE THERE ARE ONLY TWO SIXES ON THAT 10 ARTICLE? 11 MR. WINET: AFTER THE LAST ARTICLE YOU KIND OF 12 WONDER. 13 MR. COZAD: YES, YES YOU DO. 14 BY MR. COZAD: 15 Q. DID YOU RECEIVE A COPY OF MR. OTTILIE'S LETTER 16 DATED MAY 31, 2007 ON OR ABOUT THAT DATE? 17 A. I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT DAY I RECEIVED IT 18 BUT I DID RECEIVE A COPY OF THIS LETTER. 19 Q. AND DID YOU APPROVE OF THE CONTENTS OF THE 20 LETTER? 21 A. YES. 22 Q. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE HAVE MARKED AS 23 EXHIBIT 67. IT APPEARS TO BE A LETTER FROM MR. OTTILIE 24 TO DAN SHINOFF DATED JUNE 14, 2007. 25 (EXHIBIT 67 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 380 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 A. UH-HUH. 2 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: FIVE MINUTES. 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. DID YOU RECEIVE A COPY OF THIS LETTER ON OR 5 ABOUT JUNE 14, 2007? 6 A. YES. I DON'T REMEMBER THE EXACT DATE BUT YES. 7 Q. DID YOU APPROVE OF THE CONTENTS OF THE LETTER? 8 A. YES. 9 Q. LET ME SHOW YOU WHAT WE WILL MARK AS 10 EXHIBITS 68. 11 (EXHIBIT 68 MARKED FOR IDENTIFICATION.) 12 BY MR. COZAD: 13 Q. CAN YOU IDENTIFY EXHIBIT 68 FOR US, PLEASE? 14 A. IT'S -- EXCUSE ME IT'S A NOTICE OF SPECIAL 15 BOARD MEETING FOR TUESDAY, JUNE 19, CLOSED SESSION. 16 IMMEDIATELY FOLLOWING THE REGULAR BOARD MEETING 17 APPROXIMATELY 6:00 P.M. AND IT ATTACHES AN ACTION ITEM 18 CONFERENCE WITH LEGAL COUNSEL IN ANTICIPATED LITIGATION. 19 Q. IF, IF A MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC WANTED TO FIND 20 OUT WHAT CASE THIS INVOLVED, WHAT ENTITY -- YOU KNOW WHO 21 THIS INVOLVED, HOW WOULD THEY GO ABOUT FINDING THIS OUT 22 PRIOR TO THE HEARING? 23 MR. WINET: OBJECTION, CALLS FOR SPECULATION. 24 MAY LACK FOUNDATION AS TO THIS WITNESS. GO AHEAD. 25 A. I WOULD IMAGINE THEY WOULD CALL THE OFFICE OF 381 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 PUBLIC INFORMATION OR THE OFFICE OF THE PRESIDENT AND 2 THEN THEY WOULD BE REFERRED TO OUR LEGAL COUNSEL. 3 BY MR. COZAD: 4 Q. IS THERE ANYTHING ABOUT -- BY THE WAY, AND THE 5 PURPOSE OF THIS NOTICE OF SPECIAL BOARD MEETING IS TO 6 COMPLY WITH WHAT? 7 MR. WINET: OBJECTION CALLS FOR IMPROPER LEGAL 8 CONCLUSION ON BEHALF OF THIS WITNESS, LACKS FOUNDATION 9 FOUNDATION AS TO THIS WITNESS. CALLS FOR IMPROPER 10 OPINION AND CONCLUSION ON BEHALF OF THIS WITNESS. GO 11 AHEAD. 12 A. IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE I WOULD IMAGINE IT WAS 13 TO IN THE A CLOSED SESSION THAT WAS NOT NOTICED ON THE 14 INITIAL CALL OF THE BOARD MEETING FOR THE 19TH. 15 BY MR. COZAD: 16 Q. TO COMPLY WITH THE BROWN ACT? 17 A. YES. 18 Q. AND IS THERE ANYTHING IN THIS NOTICE THAT 19 WOULD ALERT A MEMBER OF THE PUBLIC THAT THE CLOSED 20 SESSION WOULD ADDRESS POTENTIAL CLAIMS THAT YOU MIGHT 21 HAVE AGAINST THE COLLEGE DISTRICT? 22 A. YOU'RE ASKING ME IF THE NOTICE ITSELF -- 23 Q. YES, MA'AM? 24 A. NO. 25 Q. IS THERE ANYTHING THAT IDENTIFIES YOU AS A 382 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 POTENTIAL LITIGANTS IN THE MATTER THAT WOULD BE 2 ADDRESSED BY THE BOARD IN CLOSED SESSION? 3 A. NO. 4 Q. WHO DIRECTED THAT THIS ITEM BE PLACED ON THE 5 AGENDA? 6 A. I DON'T KNOW. I DID NOT DO IT. 7 Q. DID YOU KNOW THAT THIS CLOSED SESSION WOULD 8 ADDRESS YOUR POTENTIAL CLAIMS AGAINST THE COLLEGE? 9 A. YES, I DID. 10 Q. WHEN DID YOU BECOME AWARE THAT THIS CLOSED 11 SESSION MAY ADDRESS YOUR POTENTIAL CLAIM AGAINST THE 12 COLLEGE? 13 A. I DON'T RECALL THE EXACT DATE WHEN MR. OTTILIE 14 LET ME KNOW THAT HE HAD BEEN INFORMED BY THE COLLEGE 15 LEGAL COUNSEL THAT THIS WOULD BE THE DATE. 16 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: ONE MINUTE. 17 MR. COZAD: WE'LL TAKE A BREAK NOW. 18 THE VIDEOGRAPHER: GOING OFF THE RECORD AT 19 545. 20 (RECESS). 21 MR. WINET: WE'VE COMPLETED THE FIRST DAY OF 22 DEPOSITION ON FRIDAY AND NOW IT'S TUESDAY WE'VE 23 COMPLETED A SECOND HALF DAY AND IT'S AROUND A QUARTER TO 24 SIX ON THE FOURTH. MY PROPOSAL IS THAT WE COMBINE THE 25 TWO DAYS INTO A FIRST VOLUME OF DR. RICHART'S 383 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 TRANSCRIPT. THAT THE EXHIBIT VOLUME BE A SEPARATE 2 \VOLUME\VOLUME{#R} THAT'S ATTACHED OTHERWISE IT'S JUST 3 GOING TO BE TOO BULKY TO DO SO THAT WE HAVE THE 4 TESTIMONY IN ONE VOLUME. THE EXHIBITS IN A SECOND 5 VOLUME. I UNDERSTAND MR. COZAD WISHES TO TAKE FURTHER 6 TESTIMONY AND WEAVER DISCUSSED OFF THE RECORD WE'LL TRY 7 TO GET AN ADDITIONAL DATE. I HAVE SOME QUESTION AS TO 8 WHETHER OR NOT IT SHOULD GO ANOTHER HALF DAY BUT WE'LL 9 ADDRESS THAT OFF THE RECORD AT A LATER DATE. 10 FOR THIS TRANSCRIPT, THE FIRST VOLUME, I WOULD 11 PROPOSE THE FOLLOWING STIPULATION: WE WILL RELIEVE THE 12 COURT REPORTER OF HER DUTIES UNDER THE CODES OF CIVIL 13 PROCEDURE. THE ORIGINAL OF THE TRANSCRIPT WILL BE SENT 14 DIRECTLY TO OUR OFFICE. WE WILL THEN FORWARD IT TO DR. 15 RICHART FOR HER REVIEW AND SIGNATURE. SHE WILL REVIEW 16 AND SIGN THE TRANSCRIPT WITHIN 30 DAYS OF OUR RECEIPT 17 AND FORWARD THE TRANSCRIPT BACK TO MY OFFICE. I WILL 18 THEN BE RESPONSIBLE FOR NOTIFYING COUNSEL OF ANY 19 CORRECTIONS OR CHANGES TO THE TRANSCRIPT. AND OUR 20 OFFICE WILL REMAIN THE CUSTODY OF THE ORIGINAL OF THE 21 TRANSCRIPT. IF NOR ANY REASON THE ORIGINAL IS NOT 22 SIGNED WITHIN 30 DAYS OR IS LOST OR CANNOT BE PRODUCED 23 AN UNSIGNED COPY CAN BE USED IN LIEU OF THE ORIGINAL FOR 24 ANY PURPOSE. 25 MR. COZAD: VERY GOOD. 384 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 MR. SLEETH: SO STIPULATED. 2 (THE DEPOSITION WAS CONCLUDED AT 5:50 P.M.) 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 385 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099 ROUGH DRAFT 1 STATE OF CALIFORNIA ) ) SS 2 COUNTY OF SAN DIEGO ) 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 I, THE UNDERSIGNED, CONFIRM THAT I HAVE READ THE 10 FOREGOING DEPOSITION, AND I DECLARE, UNDER PENALTY OF 11 PERJURY, THAT THE FOREGOING IS A TRUE AND CORRECT 12 TRANSCRIPT OF MY TESTIMONY CONTAINED THEREIN. 13 14 EXECUTED THIS _____ DAY OF ___________, 15 16 2008, AT ______________________, CALIFORNIA. 17 18 19 20 _______________________________ 21 22 VICTORIA MUNOZ RICHART-POVALL 23 24 25 386 PRECISE REPORTING SERVICE (800) 647-9099